My husband wants to cut back on canned food

PoetikDragon

Now that we have four dogs, feeding Blue Buffalo is very expensive. That's $12/day! But Gojira doesn't like dry food (of any kind) and would be severely underweight if not for canned food. Also, I really do feel like canned food, even one of lower quality, is better for the dogs than dry food. I prefer the dogs' food to be primarily meat with some vegetables and supplements. Carbohydrates and binding agents are necessary fillers for dry food.

Here are some options, I'd like your thoughts:

- Stop feeding canned food. Switch to a maximum quality (very expensive) dry food. Supplement as needed.
- Feed only half a can to each dog each day. Switch to a superior quality (somewhat expensive) dry food.
- Switch to a moderate quality (less expensive) canned food. Use the same dry food.
- Give Gojira a whole can but take the other dogs off canned food. Switch to superior quality dry with supplements.

(And no, feeding raw is not an option.)

ayk

Does Gojira still reject dry kibble that's been coated with the minimum amount of canned food?

BradA1878

Have you tried adding fish oil to Gojira's kibble?

PoetikDragon

We've tried adding a ton of things to her kibble. We've tried dog food gravy, beef or chicken broth, white rice, scrambled eggs, hot dogs (and the juice leftover in the bag), fish oil, etc. She turns her nose up at any "dressing" after a day or two, and finds ways to eat all the "toppings" (eg. eggs, rice, hot dogs) without eating the kibble. The only thing that works is mixing 2-3 cups of dry food into a can of food. The only time she'll enthusiastically eat plain kibble is when she is in heat. Other times, she might pick at it a bit if she thinks another dog might take it from her.

Hinata23

Switch her gradually into dry food. Mix it like you've been doing and gradually increase the amount of dry food. On the other hand, even though she doesn't like kibble it doesn't mean you have to keep the other dogs on canned food, right? Keeping 1 dog on canned food is much better than 4.

PoetikDragon

She's been on dry food her entire life (2 years old) she just doesn't eat much of it and gets underweight. We feed a few cups of dry in the morning (amount depends on the dog) and a can at night.

lindsayt

Sometimes I soak kibbles and then blenderize them and mix in some high cal wet food and beef lard.

Sometimes the more pressure I put on a dog to eat, the more reluctant they become. What works for my picky eater is to give him a quiet space without other dogs lurking and set the food and walk away, basically just ignoring him and not putting any pressure on him to eat.

WrylyBrindle

"Sometimes the more pressure I put on a dog to eat, the more reluctant they become. "
This is also true for peeing. "Hurrry the hell up!!" is completely counterproductive.

I will just add that Reilly gets quite thin and haggard looking unless she has a higher protein, grain free food. (im talking about her base kibble ration- she's got to go at least 28% (ie: Acana), more when i can afford it (EVO, Orijen- we rotate foods). I am sometimes reticent to go too high in case her kidneys disagree.) I took her down to Solid Gold Wolf King at 22% and she looked all drawn and bony after a few weeks. She is a senior, but I suppose it could be true of any age dog. Sage on the other hand, does best on comfort carbs and I keep his base at about 22%. He just doesnt get very big portions so he's lean and less jittery. Juno does well on anything, but mostly she;s been eating what Reilly eats due to her high activity level and young age. When you have multiple dogs, feeding them differently is more than ok!

Losech

I'd probably cut the canned from the other dog's food, or only give it every now and then, but keep giving it to Gojira and work towards getting her to eat slightly more dry, if possible.

If I give Conker space when he's eating, don't bug him at all and close the door, he'll be more likely to finish what I give him. He's being super picky about food right now, and something as small as me typing on my keyboard might make him stop eating, but if I leave the room entirely he's more likely to just sit there and stare at the bowl, so I at least have to be present.
He doesn't eat the same foods as the other two dogs either.

BradA1878

I'm a dick, I'd probably just remove the can food and keep feeding her kibble. She'll eat it eventually...

sjp051993

@brada1878, you are the furthest thing from a dick. We see how you care for all those dogs:)

ayk

A healthy dog won't starve themselves to death. The tough love is to put down food for 15 minutes at a scheduled time and then pick it up even if it's untouched. Don't offer the food again until the next scheduled time.

PoetikDragon

Yes, she will eat it eventually. But only the bare minimum to survive and not a bite more. She will always be underweight doing it that way. We've done it before. I'm all about tough love, but I'm tired of my dog looking sickly. Twice I've had a judge tell me she "lacked bone" but what they really meant was that she was out of coat (in one case) and underweight (both cases).

I spent all of my morning cross-referencing Dog Food Adviser with PetSmart's webpage to see which 5-star and 4-star dry foods are actually available in my local store. I wrote down PetSmart's price for each, the size of the bag, and the calories per kilo (data I wish was actually available on the Dog Food Adviser site, sigh). I made a badass spreadsheet, which includes calculations for cost per ounce and calories per dollar. I guess I had no better way to spend my morning.

Our current brand is three star food: Nature's Recipe Lamb & Rice 1,370kcal/$ 7.1¢/oz
Best calories per dollar five star food: Innova PRIME Grain Free Salmon & Herring 711kcal/$ 16.2¢/oz (Other Innova PRIME not as good)
Best cost per ounce five star food: Blue Buffalo Wilderness Grain Free Chicken 705kcal/$ 14.1¢/oz (All Blue Wilderness are similar)
Best calories per dollar and cost per ounce four star food: AvoDerm Natural Chicken & Brown Rice 1,092kcal/$ 9.0¢/oz (Other AvoDerm Natural not as good)
Runner Up best calories per dollar and cost per ounce four star food: Simply Nourish Chicken & Brown Rice 1,070kcal/$ 9.6¢/oz (All Simply Nourish are similar)
Best calories per dollar grain free four star food: Simply Nourish Grain Free Sweet Potato & Salmon 1,008kcal/$ 9.8¢/oz

The cost increases, above, assumes the dogs need to eat the same amount of calories on the new dry food as they do currently. I have to figure out what percentage of their caloric intake comes from canned food to see how shifting the percentage of canned vs dry will affect budgeting...

PoetikDragon

Combined, my dogs need 5,400 calories per day. Currently, it costs an average of $9.56 (canned) + $2.68 (kibble) = $12.24 to meet the dogs' daily caloric needs. Most of their nutrition and supplements are coming from the higher quality canned food, however.

Our current four star canned food: Blue Buffalo Homestyle Recipes 180kcal/$ 19.1¢/oz 431kcal/can 32% of the total calories

If canned food is removed entirely, calories from dry food would need to increase by 47%.
- Daily cost with Innova PRIME five star dry food would be $0.00 (canned) + $7.59 (kibble) = $7.59 38% savings
- Daily cost with AvoDerm Natural four star dry food would be $0.00 (canned) + $4.95 (kibble) = $4.95 60% savings
- Daily cost with current Nature's Recipe three star dry food would be $0.00 (canned) + $3.94 (kibble) = $3.94 68% savings

If cut back to one can (for Gojira) it would be 8% of the total calories. Calories from dry food would need to increase by 35%.
- Daily cost with Innova PRIME five star dry food would be $2.39 (canned) + $6.99 (kibble) = $9.38 23% savings
- Daily cost with AvoDerm Natural four star dry food would be $2.39 (canned) + $4.55 (kibble) = $6.94 43% savings
- Daily cost with current Nature's Recipe three star dry food would be $2.39 (canned) + $3.63 (kibble) = $6.02 51% savings

If cut back to two cans (1/2 per dog) it would be 16% of the total calories. Calories from dry food would need to increase by 24%.
- Daily cost with Innova PRIME five star dry food would be $4.78 (canned) + $6.39 (kibble) = $11.17 9% savings
- Daily cost with AvoDerm Natural four star dry food would be $4.78 (canned) + $4.16 (kibble) = $8.94 27% savings
- Daily cost with current Nature's Recipe three star dry food would be $4.78 (canned) + $3.31 (kibble) = $8.09 34% savings

*gasp* that was tiring to calculate... lol

I am not comfortable with a three star dry food for a dog that is not getting a full can. I am not comfortable with a four star dry food for a dog that is getting no can. So that narrows the options to:

- Stop feeding canned food and switch to Innova PRIME dry food (38% savings)
- Feed only one can (for Gojira) and switch to Innova PRIME dry food (23% savings)
- Cut back to half a can per dog and switch to AvoDerm Natural dry food (27% savings)

BradA1878

If it makes you feel any better, we're at $400/week in dog food cost right now. :oT

ayk

What mail-order company do you guys use? I've just started to venture into mail-orders, especially when they have their sales.

Losech

@brada1878 I just had a heart attack when I saw that.
I've spent less than that on food for half the year on Conker, and I thought that was a bit excessive...

sjp051993

I use to go through 40 pounds of food a month with my group. Now that Ren and Kazue are bigger I am only getting 2.5 - 3 weeks out of a 40 pound bag. I have been feeding Fromm lately as I have been getting a really good price on it from my local store. Dogs love it and Tora is in her best body condition ever. Kuma's coat has even improved on it as well.

Kuma123

@brada1878- I think my heart stopped beating for a minute when I saw that! lol

@poeticdragon, what if you just soften her dry kibble? Have you tried that yet? You could use water or plain chicken stock (I save and freeze all broth when I boil chicken or turkey off the bone and use it to liven up the kibble every now and then).

PoetikDragon

Yep, tried broth/stock. It interests her for a while, then same old story. I really am not keen on having to do fancy preparations for her, either.

jellyfish

I'm not sure how to answer because what everyone else has said is completely valid, but at this point since she may potentially be carrying puppies, I would feed her whatever she demands. Whatever it takes to get her to eat. Then again, I spoil my dog, so take it with a grain of salt.

*JackBurton*

Go up to Global Pet off of 190th and Normandie. They sell quality food at extremely good prices.

shibamistress

For most dogs, the tough love approach does work, but I've also had an Akita who wouldn't eat and doing that wasn't really an option, because she did the "eat enough to survive but be very thin" in normal circumstances, but under stress, really would starve herself (as in at the kennels, where she did not eat at all, and we had to cut a trip short to go get her). We had people thinking we were starving her, when really, she just would not eat. Her entire life was a struggle to keep any weight on her at all.

I'd cut back on the canned food with the other dogs and keep giving it to her, if it gets her eating. What is important is getting her eating, and I think in these cases whatever works, works.

@Brad, I always wondered what it costs to feed all those dogs. Now I know!

One of the reasons we do a raw diet is because it's cheaper than a really good quality kibble. We spend about $150 a month on dog food. Maybe a little more now that I'm buying Toby white fish fillets for his "spa diet"

BradnJess

@Losech Tell me about it, there was a period where everyone would freeze when Argos was eating because a creak of the stair would make him stop. Easily distracted, not all that into food.

@Poeticdragon Argos wouldn't eat strait kibble either, we did a "tough love" stint where for 2 days he wouldn't touch his kibble with regular put down/pick up times, and from there on out he would pick for the next four days.
I'd had enough, it was pretty clear he wasn't going to eat it (we even had a full treat-withdrawl), and he was starting to lose weight. We put him back on his regular "dressed kibble" and he was fine. For Arg, we go with what will get him to eat, and don't overdo it (with the exception of some tasty raw treats).
While I agree healthy dogs will eat, not all healthy dogs will eat enough to be robustly healthy (sounds odd, but it has a backwards logic appeal). Some dogs live to eat, some eat to live. Argos is definitely the latter, and the only way to keep a healthy weight on him is to try to convince him of the former.

I know it's not a revolutionary thought, but starting with a higher wet food:kibble ratio and then weening to the point where you are happy with the consumption of each dog is probably the most viable financial option? (note: we did this with Arg, and we found our "balance," but we couldn't determine it by simply decreasing the additive food steadily. It was like he knew he was being cheated. So we would go low on the additive fo a day, and then increase it the next, so it was like getting a "better deal" than yesterday, and then to make sure it wasn't a consequence of his hunger, we continued that proportion for a while. Eventually we found what worked.)

My other question is whether you adhere to strict feeding schedules or not? We were on a fixed feeding schedule with Arg, and he wasn't doing well. I like the way it was put here, it's like "pressure feeding." So we started doing "no pressure feedings" (okay, free feeding, the ugly word) and his food consumption almost doubled. I can now feel a healthy layer between his skin and his ribs, and his muscles are nice and toned, and visible. It's really semi-restricted free feeding, because food goes down after his walk, and he gets as much time as he needs to finish it, and then food goes down before bed if he finished the food earlier (which now happens 95% of the time). I believe that's been our major success, the switch in feeding styles (he's now 50 lbs, I can't lift him any more - people still call him skinny, but knowing all I know about shikoku slenderness, he's just right).

Edit: We also started supplementing canned food with some home-made wet, which was very inexpensive. We found one that Argos particularly likes, it's easy to store, and when heated (and stinky) covers kibble well with small amounts: liver sweet potato slurry (inspired by our old local pet store's Sunday brunch). We just boiled small cubes of sweet potato, drained the potato, saved the water and boiled liver in it. Reduce remaining broth and blend liver, sweet potato, and both together. Freezes very well. We could make twice the volume of canned for the same price. Of course, I don't consider this to be a main food because I do not have the knowledge to balance canine food, so only small amounts went over his kibble (Orijen).

PoetikDragon

As of recently, my dogs have free access to dry food any time they are in their runs (which is mostly while I work during the day). We got gravity feeders so they could eat as much as they want - all four could use a little more meat on their bones, which I am now starting to see. The dogs are put back in their runs (if they were out to exercise, play, etc) between 7pm and 9pm to be given their canned food for dinner.

LynnC

@brada1878 OMG Brad, we don't spend that much feed 15 horses... Close but not that much. OUCH

T_Dog

I have heard that canned food will make your pet loose its teeth early in life. I have not seen a food that is for gaining weight. I wonder then what could be added to the kibble to make a dog gain weight. I see several good idea here to get the dog to eat. I do know a dog can go a whole week with out eating, and that small changes in diet will set it off. If I feed my akita a small chunk of roast beef cooked, he gets an upset tummy, and won't eat for a day, and my Shiba is worse he got pancreatic problems because I feed him a pork chop cooked, he started puking and got depressed and wouldn't eat hardly anything for two weeks. So I guess I agree with the slow weening off the wet food method. Cuz some dogs just don't adjust to change mentally an physically. I also heard that when people do the switch to raw, they quit feeding for 4 or 5 days to empty the dogs system and so they are hungry enough to eat anything that u put in front of them. Makes sense to do that even if u are just switching from soft to hard food. Of course she is pregnant, so u got that to think of. But just knowing that wolves can go a week with out eating and that a dog can do nearly the same, made me feel much better when my shiba quit eating when he was fighting pancritis, it is funny how dogs just know what to do. The vet said that when they get pancritis they shouldn't eat much anyways, cuz it helps them heal.

Zinja

I think 400 feeds my household for a month!

If you guys think thats impressive, Brad posted a photo of how much poop all those dogs produce some time ago... Now thats impressive!

oddball

Guess I should consider myself lucky that my mutt eats almost anything and no matter how little or how much she eats, she always weighs the same. Only thing that upsets her stomach is to much green apple and She loves green apple slices.

T_Dog

Oh ya I was also feeding my shiba a raw egg with his IAMS dry puppy food once a day for about a week, then a full pork chop and the vet said to much rich foods. I have switched my food to wellness it is a five star food. I think IAMS was a three star food.