Oh I'm so glad that everyone is chiming in with things they need help with.
@Myabee09 Oh that is so promising! I always tell my dogs to "say hi" which helps with them knowing that it's ok to go up to someone or to not be scared of them. It also helps me from having Mika go up to everyone! She can only greet when I say "say hi".
Well we had a slight incident on Tuesday evening. Since Koda is still in recovery mode, we can't walk as far as I used to take the dogs or when I just have Mika. He's not up for it all yet. He usually goes to sleep pretty quickly after a walk. When he does, Mika goes to grab a toy and comes up to me to play. We have been playing for about an hour together each evening to get her puppy energy out.
Since Koda is asleep, I take his harness and tags off when we get home. Well I didn't hear him come down the hallway. Mika and I were playing tug of war and keep away with a little running around the living room and wrestling when he walked in the edge of the room. Mika went flying up to him full speed and snapped her mouth and growled. Well, she was playing so hard and running so fast that she caught his muzzle. Nothing bad at all, and I honestly don't think she wanted to make contact, she was just going too fast to stop.
The good thing about this situation is this is the worst that would happen. Koda would never fight with her, and I know she wouldn't attack Koda. It's really just bully behavior. Koda cowered when she got him and backed up. Mika quickly started kissing him, play bowing, and laying on her back. Koda wouldn't acknowledge her existence. He won't tolerate such behavior and is really good at cutting rude dogs off and essentially pretending like they don't exist. Well this set Mika into panic mode because usually Koda is so receptive to her come ons. He wouldn't go near her all night and the next morning.
The good news is, he taught her a lesson. She hasn't growled, snarled, or snapped at him since, and I even set her up for failure twice to see if she would. Mika learns from other dogs a lot faster than she learns from me.
Is this ok, or am I going about this the wrong way? I'm trying, but we just moved really far away from all of our friends and family. I don't really know anyone around here yet that could help me on a regular basis, but I want Shelby to be ok. I don't know where this came from... It was like an overnight change.
You just moved?
If that's the case then that's the overnight change. Just like you don't know anyone, she's not used to the sounds, sites, and smells of your new hood. The only constant in her life is you, so she's turning to you for confidence in a new situation. This is perfectly normal. Give her time, allow her to explore and go at her own pace on walks, and try to keep to the same loop on a walk so she can get really familiar with the area.
@tmd we are and have been working with a behaviorist. I actually had to revert to small leash corrections and then treating after she calms down and we are making improvement, its just a long and exhausting process
@Myabee09 I'm glad to hear she had some good experiences. You did great with getting the kids to help you out. It's all about building more positive experiences than negative ones. Maybe try bringing treats along too, which you can give to your "helpers". Taking another dog (Mya) that acts in the way you want can be a great example for a fearful dog. Did the fearfulness start when you moved or just get worse? Either way I agree with @tjbart17 that a move to a new place can be a catalyst for a host of behavioral issues.
@tjbart17 That's great about Koda showing Mika what the consequences of her naughty behavior are. Just out of curiosity does Mika have any health issues? e.g. poor eyesight or hearing? Sounded like she was surprised by Koda, but quickly switched once she realized who it was. I've heard some dogs react that way when they are going blind or deaf. Not to worry you, but sometimes behavior issues are physiological rather than psychological.
Oh @brittk I wish you the best of luck then. It's so hard to live with a dog-reactive dog. I should know, I have one too. Thankfully we live in a neighborhood in the country where there aren't any other dogs so I haven't spent too much time working on it because she's really quite pleasant otherwise.
All please let us know how things are going. What impresses me and makes this a great community is the ability to share the good and the bad and find support for both.
@tmd Nope Mika is a very healthy 14 month old puppy who was not surprised at all by Koda's entrance into the room. She actually heard and saw him before me. Maybe I worded the story funky. I was the one who didn't hear or see him until she ran up to snap.
I don't think Mika has a behavior issue. She is a normal puppy who was ripped from her home and Koda for 2 months, then ripped from me for 3 weeks, and then just plopped back into her life two weeks ago to be taken away from our home again because of a flood and to be brought back home last weekend. She just needs to settle back in, but in the meantime she shouldn't be an asshole to Koda. He's sensitive. ha ha ha
@tjbart17 She acted like this before we moved. It was one night, a group of guys next door to us were all outside. She had met them before and gotten along really well with everyone. This night, though, she was really afraid and I told her they were friends, but it didn't help. I wound up taking her inside and she was fine after that. But now she is afraid of all strangers, especially men, and she's even afraid of people she knows, but only on her leash.
I'm going to get her some more training treats today and try to enlist the help of my neighbors. Everyone I meet seems to be ok with helping us.
That's so strange! maybe something about them that night gave her a reeeally bad vibe? Other than that I don't know and it's weird that that would have affected her so drastically! Just keep working at it!! That'a so sweet too everyone is so willing to help!! Kona is a little shy around kids too, we've been working at that for a while and enlisting all the little kids on our block too haha
Bella was doing this to Suki whenever he tried to join us on the bed. I physically got between them a few times, then eased Bella back into things- Patting her whilst having Suki hop up on the other side of me, I would keep a thumb under her collar. Patting her whenever Suki approached and she stayed calm. Etc.
Well, we have had some major success tonight! On our last walk of the evening, my husband had Mya and I was walking Shelby. As soon as we stepped out of our building, two guys came running around the corner. As soon as Shelby saw them, she went in protect mode and started baking and got between me and the two guys. They slowed down and I told Shelby to sit. She obeyed and say right next to me. The guys were just our neighbors, so my husband struck up a conversation. Shelby never moved and even sniffed one of the guys hands just before we walked off. She seemed calm, as in I never saw a sign of stress as long as she was sitting, and didn't try to run away. Once I told her it was ok to walk away, she did so calmly and never once pulled her leash. Mya was in her usual spirits and sniffed the daylights out of their shoes. We saw some other people later in the walk and I made Shelby sit with the same success as earlier. Thank you all for the advice!!! I'll post periodically with her progress and I hope this trend continues!
Congrats @Myabee09, I'm so happy to hear about that great win! Now that you have shown Shelby the appropriate response she is becoming more confident. What great news!
@tjbart17 I was going through old Kai pics and I think I found one of mika and if it is it is my favorite...ever. She is crated at Brad and Jen's and while all the other dogs are on their beds she has flipped hers up against the side of the crate and is peering out just over it looking like she is prepped for the zombie apocalypse. Amazing!
Sorry everyone work has been heck. I haven't had time to breath.
I'm proud to announce that Mika and Koda are 99% back to their old ways. The 1% is that Koda hasn't been making out with her much.
Now that Koda is doing better physically, I've been able to take them places together again to run and play. This, I think, has made all the difference in their relationship. Koda and I play stalk and pounce Koda. She's not thrilled about it, but she is happy to have her Koda Bear back and puts up with it. lol.
@cdenney Which pic? I want to see it! Mika seriously has the cutest face. She melts people, and makes them go "ahhhhhhh" :-D
Since everyone was so helpful to me on this thread, I figure I should give an update on Shelby. She was doing amazing until about 2 days ago. Some kids were out playing with a large bouncy ball and they threw it in the air when we walked past. Well, the wind took the ball and it hit Shelby. Now she doesn't even want to go down the stairs.
We are starting over with everything and I hope it works again.
@Myabee09 - That's really strange that Shelby is so sensitive like that. Her parents are both very outgoing and friendly. I wonder where that's coming from...
I have no idea. She was super friendly and this just came on all of a sudden about a month before we moved. She got afraid of a friend of ours that has always been super nice to her. It has just snowballed from there... We are working with her though. And it's so weird, but she does fine with strangers at the dog park.
Could be with change of home and the kids activities nearby and all she gets a little over stimulated and quickly? I think she'll settle down back to the dog you know in a week or two. Just stay as normal and positive as possible. We have months of awesome then something (usually unidentifiable) that will make sachi keyed up for a few days then she returns to her happy easy going perky little self. If you know the cause super treat it ie just a step going down of her own volition and she'll bounce back faster.
Shelby is also young right? She could be going through one of her fear periods, there is a link in the forums somewhere, ill check when home.
Thanks y'all. I would just let her off leash, but it's against the law here and she could be taken away from me for that. Maybe a new leash? The other day I was upset, but I just had thoughts. I didn't say or do anything different from normal other than tell her it's ok.
I'm going to go through what happened on our walk earlier. Maybe it will help.
Her normal first walk of the day. I woke up and feed the small dogs. Shelby was excited and doing her helicopter butt move. I let her out and she ran to the door. I clipped her leash and we walked out the door. We walked down the hall and turned the corner to go down the stairs. At the top of the stairs she sat and her ears were back. She saw her reflection in the glass door. I stepped down a few stairs and kneeled in front of her. I told her it was ok and she then got up, licked my hair, and went down the steps. When we walked out the door, we took our usual left turn on the grass and she squatted to urinate. Some kids were across the courtyard from us, so to keep her from focusing on them, I praised her throughout her potty time. When she was done, her tail was down and we kept walking. I told her she was a good girl all the time we were walking. Well, she pooped and I bagged it up. There wasn't a bag in the closest bin, so we walked to another one on the other side of the building next to the dumpster. When she saw her shadow, she lost it. I didn't expect her to react to her shadow because she never had before. She flailed and wound up slipping her collar. She didn't run too far, and when I got to her I could barely calm her down. She was shaking and everything. Serious signs of stress. I put her collar back on, petted her, and told her thank you for letting me put her collar back on (I tell her thank you when she does things like that rather than say good girl. I feel like it would be praising her for bring scared). Then we walked back inside and I asked her if she was hungry. She ran to her kennel and I fed her so I could let the other two out. When I came back in, she was done eating so I let her out to roam and she was fine.
If I had let any of the kids go near her, she would have lost it, but not that bad. She sits down and starts to tremble.
I can't really control the environment of our walks. I try to keep the kids away, but if I say anything, Shelby gets even more upset. They run around playing and they get close sometimes. I just try to distract Shelby and try to pretend that all this is something she is ok with. I do that by acting like having her sit and distracting her is normal.
That's pretty much it. I'm going to get her some super stinky treats that she likes and use those as a reward when she does good things on her walks. I would take Mya with us, but it hasn't helped. Mya and her love of everyone draws people closer and Shelby gets even more upset. I'm willing to do anything to help Shelby, even if that means hopping on one leg while wearing a Viking hat and singing show tunes.
Edit: I just had a thought... I hate to admit this... I have social anxiety and am on medication for the disorder. My meds aren't working very well lately and I am waiting on insurance to kick in before I go back to the doctor. Could Shelby be taking on anxiety she senses in me?
And I have been thinking more and more about this. I had my first panic attack in a long time around the time Shelby started acting like this. What do I do? I feel so bad for her because she's like this and even worse for my having possibly caused this.
Other than seeing a doctor to get on a medication that does help with your anxiety, which will hopefully reduce Shelby's if she's reacting to you, maybe you need to remove yourself from the walk equation until you can get back to normal. Is there someone else who can walk her for you? Someone who can report back on her behavior during the walk so you can gauge if she's improving or maybe take video?
ETA: Had another thought. Maybe you just need to change where you're taking the longer walks with her. Somewhere more secluded where you don't feel as anxious?
Comments
@Myabee09 Oh that is so promising! I always tell my dogs to "say hi" which helps with them knowing that it's ok to go up to someone or to not be scared of them. It also helps me from having Mika go up to everyone! She can only greet when I say "say hi".
Well we had a slight incident on Tuesday evening. Since Koda is still in recovery mode, we can't walk as far as I used to take the dogs or when I just have Mika. He's not up for it all yet. He usually goes to sleep pretty quickly after a walk. When he does, Mika goes to grab a toy and comes up to me to play. We have been playing for about an hour together each evening to get her puppy energy out.
Since Koda is asleep, I take his harness and tags off when we get home. Well I didn't hear him come down the hallway. Mika and I were playing tug of war and keep away with a little running around the living room and wrestling when he walked in the edge of the room. Mika went flying up to him full speed and snapped her mouth and growled. Well, she was playing so hard and running so fast that she caught his muzzle. Nothing bad at all, and I honestly don't think she wanted to make contact, she was just going too fast to stop.
The good thing about this situation is this is the worst that would happen. Koda would never fight with her, and I know she wouldn't attack Koda. It's really just bully behavior. Koda cowered when she got him and backed up. Mika quickly started kissing him, play bowing, and laying on her back. Koda wouldn't acknowledge her existence. He won't tolerate such behavior and is really good at cutting rude dogs off and essentially pretending like they don't exist. Well this set Mika into panic mode because usually Koda is so receptive to her come ons. He wouldn't go near her all night and the next morning.
The good news is, he taught her a lesson. She hasn't growled, snarled, or snapped at him since, and I even set her up for failure twice to see if she would. Mika learns from other dogs a lot faster than she learns from me.
If that's the case then that's the overnight change. Just like you don't know anyone, she's not used to the sounds, sites, and smells of your new hood. The only constant in her life is you, so she's turning to you for confidence in a new situation. This is perfectly normal. Give her time, allow her to explore and go at her own pace on walks, and try to keep to the same loop on a walk so she can get really familiar with the area.
@tjbart17 That's great about Koda showing Mika what the consequences of her naughty behavior are. Just out of curiosity does Mika have any health issues? e.g. poor eyesight or hearing? Sounded like she was surprised by Koda, but quickly switched once she realized who it was. I've heard some dogs react that way when they are going blind or deaf. Not to worry you, but sometimes behavior issues are physiological rather than psychological.
Oh @brittk I wish you the best of luck then. It's so hard to live with a dog-reactive dog. I should know, I have one too. Thankfully we live in a neighborhood in the country where there aren't any other dogs so I haven't spent too much time working on it because she's really quite pleasant otherwise.
All please let us know how things are going. What impresses me and makes this a great community is the ability to share the good and the bad and find support for both.
I don't think Mika has a behavior issue. She is a normal puppy who was ripped from her home and Koda for 2 months, then ripped from me for 3 weeks, and then just plopped back into her life two weeks ago to be taken away from our home again because of a flood and to be brought back home last weekend. She just needs to settle back in, but in the meantime she shouldn't be an asshole to Koda. He's sensitive. ha ha ha
I'm going to get her some more training treats today and try to enlist the help of my neighbors. Everyone I meet seems to be ok with helping us.
Patting her whilst having Suki hop up on the other side of me, I would keep a thumb under her collar.
Patting her whenever Suki approached and she stayed calm. Etc.
We now have a 97.98% success rate.
I'm proud to announce that Mika and Koda are 99% back to their old ways. The 1% is that Koda hasn't been making out with her much.
Now that Koda is doing better physically, I've been able to take them places together again to run and play. This, I think, has made all the difference in their relationship. Koda and I play stalk and pounce Koda. She's not thrilled about it, but she is happy to have her Koda Bear back and puts up with it. lol.
@cdenney Which pic? I want to see it! Mika seriously has the cutest face. She melts people, and makes them go "ahhhhhhh" :-D
We are starting over with everything and I hope it works again.
We are working with her though. And it's so weird, but she does fine with strangers at the dog park.
Shelby is also young right? She could be going through one of her fear periods, there is a link in the forums somewhere, ill check when home.
The other day I was upset, but I just had thoughts. I didn't say or do anything different from normal other than tell her it's ok.
I'm going to go through what happened on our walk earlier. Maybe it will help.
Her normal first walk of the day. I woke up and feed the small dogs. Shelby was excited and doing her helicopter butt move. I let her out and she ran to the door. I clipped her leash and we walked out the door. We walked down the hall and turned the corner to go down the stairs. At the top of the stairs she sat and her ears were back. She saw her reflection in the glass door. I stepped down a few stairs and kneeled in front of her. I told her it was ok and she then got up, licked my hair, and went down the steps. When we walked out the door, we took our usual left turn on the grass and she squatted to urinate. Some kids were across the courtyard from us, so to keep her from focusing on them, I praised her throughout her potty time. When she was done, her tail was down and we kept walking. I told her she was a good girl all the time we were walking. Well, she pooped and I bagged it up. There wasn't a bag in the closest bin, so we walked to another one on the other side of the building next to the dumpster. When she saw her shadow, she lost it. I didn't expect her to react to her shadow because she never had before. She flailed and wound up slipping her collar. She didn't run too far, and when I got to her I could barely calm her down. She was shaking and everything. Serious signs of stress. I put her collar back on, petted her, and told her thank you for letting me put her collar back on (I tell her thank you when she does things like that rather than say good girl. I feel like it would be praising her for bring scared). Then we walked back inside and I asked her if she was hungry. She ran to her kennel and I fed her so I could let the other two out. When I came back in, she was done eating so I let her out to roam and she was fine.
If I had let any of the kids go near her, she would have lost it, but not that bad. She sits down and starts to tremble.
I can't really control the environment of our walks. I try to keep the kids away, but if I say anything, Shelby gets even more upset. They run around playing and they get close sometimes. I just try to distract Shelby and try to pretend that all this is something she is ok with. I do that by acting like having her sit and distracting her is normal.
That's pretty much it. I'm going to get her some super stinky treats that she likes and use those as a reward when she does good things on her walks. I would take Mya with us, but it hasn't helped. Mya and her love of everyone draws people closer and Shelby gets even more upset. I'm willing to do anything to help Shelby, even if that means hopping on one leg while wearing a Viking hat and singing show tunes.
Edit:
I just had a thought... I hate to admit this...
I have social anxiety and am on medication for the disorder. My meds aren't working very well lately and I am waiting on insurance to kick in before I go back to the doctor. Could Shelby be taking on anxiety she senses in me?
ETA: Had another thought. Maybe you just need to change where you're taking the longer walks with her. Somewhere more secluded where you don't feel as anxious?