Dogs vs Children
With the pregnant ladies taking over the thread and worries of our animals adjusting to the new baby, it makes me ask..when do you think that someone has a valid excuse to rehome a dog (or any animal) because of a new addition? So many people use the new baby as an excuse to get rid of their family members because they don't want to deal with it. Where's the line between "poor excuse" and "valid excuse"?
Comments
I think a valid excuse would be a serious financial burden OR the baby is allergic to the pup.
But even these can be gotten around I suppose if one were to really try, which means there are excuses that are close to valid, but never really truly valid.
I mean, an excuse is an excuse and never really acceptable anyway...
Personally, I don't think I could ever do it though. But then again I do NOT want children anyway. ~
Allergies aside, I don't think I would be able to give up my "little furry baby". (Yes, I call her that.) I would do everything in my power to acclimate her to the changes to come and work as diligently as possible to insure that my Tosca would never find herself homeless again.
*edit- If everything - absolutely everything - didn't work, then I would have to assume that she was destined to brighten some other lucky person's home and attempt to help find them for her. It would, however, break my heart.
I think Rina hit the nail on the head. Hard to know what choices we each would make until we are faced with very difficult decisions/choices (for whatever reason we can't fathom now). Hopefully if it were not possible to give your dog (or your child, for that matter) a life and the care it deserved there would be opportunity for a loving replacement. Probably best to talk about it with nearest and dearest friends and family now while everything seems rosy and like you'll never part, so that in a true emergency that would not be yet another unbearable situation to deal with.
As family members visited us for Thanksgiving, both my sister and my niece said (partway in jest) that Josephine could come home with them any time. Same was true of Joe, our former dog. I think we are fortunate in having (several) people in the immediate family that would step up and offer a wonderful home if the need arose.
Sadly if you Google "preventing animal allergies" the number 1 (if not the only) suggestion is giving up your animals.
Our previous dog (a mini dachshund) was very undersocialized and reacted poorly to many situations because of it. She did not like strangers, and never really did well with unknown children. My step father didn't treat her as a family member(wouldn't even play or cuddle with her) and as a result, she didn't like him much either. He claimed on several occasions that she bit him, which I don't think was true. I think it's likely that she snarled at him and maybe snapped, but I don't think she would have bit. When my brother arrived she was about 8 years old, and starting to get cranky on top of her other issues. In general we tried to keep the two of them separate, but one night my mom and I were out and she was left with my brother and step father. I guess at some point my brother had cornered her, and was poking at her or pulling her ears... and since she had no place to run, she reacted in the only way she could. She bit him and broke the skin. I came home to my dog hiding in my room, and step father downstairs rocking a screaming toddler.
Of course he insisted the dog had to go. She was a danger to the entire family. I was furious. It would have never happened if he actually paid attention to what my brother was doing and paid respect to her boundaries by removing him from the situation.
For the record, my brother is now five years old, has never been fearful of dogs, and has no scars from that incident. And he still doesn't have any dog manners.
My first cat was rehomed because I was running around the house and decided to jump over her. I didn't jump far enough and landed right on top of her. She freaked and scratched up both my legs. I was crying bloody murder not because my legs hurt but because they were taking her away from me.
My second cat was taken to the shelter when he attacked my brother, probably provoked also (my brother was 2 years old) but I wasn't there so I never got the full story.
Most of my childhood animals were rehomed or died prematurely because of poor care and the "animals are replaceable" mentality that my mother has. I'm still surprised I came out the way I did.
I don't know if I will ever get over what happened with Cleo. She was a huge part of my life, and taken away for a stupid reason.
For money, I can't EVER see that happening. If I didn't think I could afford my dogs, I'd move somewhere cheap to live, sell the car, sell anything else I had... I'd basically make my life so inexpensive that I could support myself on even the crappiest of jobs. Basically, I would change everything else about my life before I would get rid of the dogs. Of course, I already sort of do that in a way. I live in an old mobile home and drive a crappy car to avoid having to make payments on anything because I hate the idea of debt and I want to be able to afford other things.
This kind of reminds me of how my parents got rid of a cat when I was a kid because my sister kept throwing the cat down the stairs. That makes absolutely no sense to me. Why couldn't they just teach her not to throw the cat down the stairs? Barring that, why couldn't they just keep the kid from being able to throw the cat down the stairs? Seems like a pretty stupid reason to me.
My parents would definitely take pong if my child become allergic to her.. but hopefully since there's no animal allergy prominent in my family, there will be less of a chance my kid has allergies.
In regards to children and dogs, I am horribly opposed to the idea of people rehoming a dog due to inconvenience of having both.
Dogs are work.
Children likely more.
If you are having a child and you know your dog is not good with children, I would try like hell to work the dog past that issue before the child is born. Even if it means having a behaviorist in your home 3 times a week before the baby is born and after.
When we take a dog into our home and we are assuming responsibility for their safety, their wellness, and their emotional well being for their entire lives.
That said, if after doing all the necessary work to try to make it work with a dog with kid issues, that dog still shows aggression toward the child then I do believe that re-homing the dog, while heartbreaking, is an appropriate action.
I admit, that being that I am not pregnant and have gone to great lengths to make sure that I will never be, I have not been reading the pregnancy thread. I hope that is not an issue for any of our expectant moms on the forum. I hope that this is only a theoretical discussion.
this is a timely topic!
we adopted kitsune fully understanding his reason for surrender (which was something like "is not adjusting well to new baby"). He was skittish of children, but its not children in particular he is skittish of, its anything new and unfamiliar in the form of a person.
We also were not planning on children, but life is what it is. We have time to prepare. We have always been pushing Kitsune a little bit further each time we take him into a social situation and he has improved a great deal in the past year, especially with adults. We have not had him successfully around small children, but Tsuki is amazing. Its work, and he is a work in progress.
I wouldn't trust one single dog around a baby or small child alone anyway, so Kitsune's uneasiness with the unfamiliar and unpredictable does not threaten his place in the home we all share.
With close friends, dog play date acquaintances and family members, it takes a good 3-4 times of meeting them for him to be comfortable interacting with them. I suspect that with a new baby, it will be a similar process. Having a dog is work, its never really easy and I never expected it to be, so this time around, we'll help him adjust, whatever it takes, we'll get him there.
I guess the only time I would ever consider rehoming a resident dog is when they pose a serious harm to a human family member (through no fault of the human) and when all behavior modification has failed... then its appropriate to think of other options for a home for the dog/cat/etc.
I'm also allergic to cats but zyrtec and really good vacuum and cleaning regimen allows me to help during kitten season.
One can never really tell what will occur once your children are born. Children are fast and most adults once they have one or two toddlers running about can not keep track of events. In many cases adults expect their child to be able to crawl all over a dog and the dog to take it, like you see in the movies or tv.
Never say never about needing to give up a dog, it really depends on the dynamics of the family and personality of the dog. Some dogs become scared or depressed once a baby comes. Therefore, I don't pass judgment on those who seek to give up due various issues revolving around a baby. Most likely the parent (usually the mother) is not able to cope with the combination of things. Kids like to push the envelope to get a reaction either from the parent, or the dog in or to get more attention of the parent. So from birth to age 9 yrs kids can be just horrible to pets if they are not give limits and structure on how to behave. If you have to lock a dog away half of its life before your child develops then the dog needs a new home where it can get the attention it deserves, rather than living like a mushroom.
Parenting for both kids as well as four footed takes real dedication...It is no easy task.
To throw out a few examples, my god son at age three would sit at the table and kick his feet at the resting dogs to see if he could hit them or get a start for them to jump up. Also , he would also try to sleep in the dog beds and play with their toys, the same toys the dogs wanted. Structuring was easier because he did not live with us 24/7 but if it were otherwise I know my one dog would have been miserable. The baby was not necessarily mean but would push the limits and boundaries.
As a parent you have to be doubly aware of your limits, the dogs limits and now your childs. Overcoming some of it has to do setting up good modeling as a parent and also sharing dog tasks very early and also providing time outs for the kids, which many folks do not want to do with their child since they have an unrealistic view of their progeny.
For those of you about to be parents here is a good resource called living with kids and dogs without losing your mind.
http://www.amazon.com/Living-Kids-Dogs-Without-Losing-Your/dp/1933562668
Colleen Pilear is super and she even has a day camp that kids can attend with their dog when they are old enough.
She trains at All About Dogs in Woodbridge VA.
Snf
If given persistent guidance and direction, I can't see any child keeping up this behaviour permanently. It does mean a few solid years of dealing endlessly with toddler impulses, but that's not limited to parents with dogs. Isaac also likes throwing things in the toilet, but I haven't considered getting rid of the toilet.
Snf - thanks for linking to that book! I am definitely going to buy that one!
While we had the intention on rehoming Hanzo from the start, having him in our home actually does pose a slight risk to me now (*if* he gets out of the barrier, *if* he tries to bite a dog and I get in the way then need antibiotics, shots, etc). I do not at all regret pulling him from the shelter, but I am sad I won't be able to see it completely through. Thank goodness for NYCSR, they hope to have him in a dogless foster home by the end of January. I am very grateful for dog welfare and rescue groups.
We have discussed how life will change for the dogs and that we have to make conscious decisions on continuing to involve them as much as they are now. They are my babies I cant imagine life without them and I will do whatever is in my power to keep life going well for all parties from minute one. We have already started adapting things. They will no longer be in my car due to its size. 2 dogs in the backseat with car seat is not gonna work. We now have the seats up in the blazer with them in the back (this was a very hard transition for Sasha, but progress is being made). We are leaving toys around and Telling Niko leave it (we just need to make sure that we watch her, our fault not hers), She knows leave it, she just isnt used to hearing it because everything has been hers. And we will teach Elijah what is the dogs toys and for him to leave it. They are allowed in the nursery only with us in there....
It is doable. Not easy. But doable. And according to her, absolutely worth it.