Picking a Breeder

edited March 2010 in Kai Ken (甲斐犬)
So here is the big question! I've got about a year or so before I'll be ready for a puppy. I've done A LOT of research in past year about the breed itself. Now its time to buckle down and pick a breeder so I can secure my chances of actually getting a puppy. So like I said the big question: How do I decide on a breeder?! I've kept in contact with Marsha from Mijikai Kennels. I like that she does keep in contact with everyone on her mailing list and every time I email her she is very prompt, professional, and informative. I would choose her for those reasons but I haven't talked to any other breeders (making me a bit bias) so I don't want to limit myself. Please help, not sure where to go from here!

Comments

  • edited November -1
    Communication is a good start, like you have above, but I think we have to face that not everyone is an avid emailer, they don't all like computers, so if they DON'T communicate this way, that might not be such a strike against them.

    Here's what I look for, but please note that your choices of nihonken breeders are limited, so you're not going to get all of these things in the same breeder.

    I look for a breeder who has made good, thoughtful decisions on what bitch they are breeding to which male, and can tell you why they complement each other, not necessarily simply because they both reside in their kennel (although again, with nihonken breeds, this probably can't be helped).

    I want the parents health checked for hips and eyes at least. I want to know that the mama dog is eating a good, high quality food, not something cheap.

    I want to know that the puppies will be born in the house and raised in the house around lots of people and lots of noise, not outside to a bitch tied to a doghouse on a chain.

    I want to know that the breeder knows about socializing the puppies and exposing them to new toys and new places up to 8 weeks of age while in her care. I look for a breeder that won't sell them too soon (like 5 weeks) nor too late, and if by chance she is stuck with 4-month old puppies, that she knows enough to get them separated from their littermates and their mother. I HATE and I do mean HATE to see websites where breeders advertise their half-grown puppies running around together, happy as clams, now more dog-oriented than people-oriented, puppies who will find it harder to bond with their new owners. Pluck that puppy into a quiet, single-dog home and how happy do you think he will be, suddenly all by himself? Nothing wrong with single-dog homes, but they'll adjust MUCH better at 8 weeks than at 4 months.

    If you want an example of what I mean, check out the thread on "Raising Wyatt" under Other Breeds that I just wrote, complete with pictures. Note how friendly the puppies are towards people, and they are just 5 weeks old. Note how many toys they have in their playpen. The breeder went out and bought toys from a toy store that make noise, move, that challenge them, she changes the location of the playpen occasionally, she lets the puppies out and leads them around the house and in and out of her house, up and down steps, takes them for short car rides and just recently, the mama's co-owner took them to her office for the day. These puppies will take new experiences and new people all in stride, even before they ever leave her home.
  • edited November -1
    This may sound obvious, but I would look for a breeder who has a good health management/veterinary program.

    Sukoshi came out of puppy mill lines. When I got her she had: kennel cough, round worm, coccidia, and giardia. She was diagnosed with hip dyplasia at 9 months.
  • edited November -1
    I forgot a few things:

    A good breeder will of course screen you carefully before you get one of her puppies. There is usually a questionnaire involved, and a deposit when the puppies are born. The breeder will want to know what kind of time you have for the puppy, how many children you have, especially those under a certain age, whether your home is suitable, they will prefer a fenced in yard or ask at least who is going to deal with the dog on its many walks, and what you want to do with this dog, for what purpose are you getting him.

    Ideally, a breeder might pay some attention to when he breeds his bitches and when the puppies would be going to their new homes. It is much more difficult to socialize and housebreak a puppy in the dark of a long cold winter. Spring/summer puppies are much easier to get out
  • edited November -1
    As Marion pointed out, there just aren't that many options if you're set on a Kai Ken. That can be a good or a bad thing depending on how you look at it. The downside is obviously that your choices are limited. The upside is you can "play the entire field" and speak to them all before making your decision.

    Ultimately it comes down to your comfort. We can give you a set of criteria to look for, but I'm telling you right now you won't find a breeder that meets them all. That doesn't mean the Kai breeders are bad. It's just a reality. There is no perfect breeder.

    When you get a puppy from a breeder, you are buying into a life-long relationship with that breeder. Their involvement should not end the day you pick up your puppy. So first and foremost, make sure you have a good relationship with the breeder you choose. Make sure you can communicate with them in a way you are comfortable with.

    I'd also suggest visiting the breeder before you make your decision. You can learn a lot about a breeder and their ethics by how they keep their dogs. If you can meet the parents of your puppy too, that's even better. Don't be afraid to ask to interact with them either. Poking your fingers through a kennel door is not sufficient interaction to get a feel for a dog's temperament. If the breeder isn't comfortable allowing you to interact with the dogs, that should tell you something about the temperament of the parents that should set off a red flag.

    Get referrals. Ask the breeder for contact information of owners they have placed puppies with in the past. If you can get contact information for people that own offspring of your puppies parents, even better. Talk to them about their dogs as well as their relationship with the breeder. If you can visit those dogs too, even better still.

    Really, the best advice I can give you is to put in the effort to contact and meet breeders, then make the best decision you can with the information you have. Once you've made it, just relax and enjoy the ride. :-)
  • edited March 2010
    Good advice here. I really liked what MontanaDoglover said about the older pups. I got my girl Shiba at a little over 4 months, and she'd had virtually no socialization with people--had just run around in a big pack of dogs, and she is (at almost 5) still really bad with people. She's a spooky, skittish little thing with people other than me and my husband and one other friend (and even with that friend it's hit or miss). And the advice about going to visit the breeder is great....I've never been able to do it, myself, because they are usually not that close, but if possible it's great.

    I don't have anything to add, but felt the info. was good for me too.

    There is a thread here somewhere about this topic, too, that might have even more info.

    Can I add a question? When is it too early to start looking for a breeder? I've been looking for a JA and know I'm not going to be ready to get one this year, but have contacted a couple of breeders (and some were gracious enough to get back to me even though I'm not looking for a puppy this year). But now I wonder if I'm doing this too early? I was thinking people might have waiting lists, etc, so it might be ok, but maybe I should wait til it is closer to when I plan to get one...)
  • edited November -1
    I'm not sure I totally agree with Marion about the older pups getting adopted out. My breeder tends to be a little choosey on who gets her dogs. She had a boy who lived with his parents at her house until he was one because she denied the first purchaser. When he did find a home, he acclamaited to his new home just fine. I spoke to his owners after finding him on a forum before I got Koda. Maybe this was just a fluke, but flukes happen.
  • edited November -1
    Re: older pups....probably depends on the individual pup as well as the situation...I would imagine that leaving a pup with the parents, if the parents are around people a lot would be fine, but leaving a pup to run around in a pack of half grown pups which only have contact with people when they're getting fed is a totally different thing....And my girl may be just an odd little thing anyway. But I do think (now) that I got her from a not great breeder who let didn't socialize them enough...
  • edited November -1
    I read this thread title as "Pickling a Breeder". LMAO
  • edited November -1
    That's when you go meet a breeder and bring lots of wine and stuff, talk late into the night and go home with a puppy. :)
  • edited November -1
    Now that sounds like a good breeder experience! :o)
  • edited March 2010
    that's how I plan to get a breeder to approve me for a kai pup someday. Strategy, people! :P LOL

    "SO then I shay, 'Reactive dog? Wotthhell!' and I givesh her a puppy anyway..."
  • edited November -1
    HAHAHAHAHAHA
  • edited November -1
    OMG! LMAO!! ~
  • edited November -1
    that's how I plan to get a breeder to approve me for a kai pup someday. Strategy, people! :P LOL

    "SO then I shay, 'Reactive dog? Wotthhell!' and I givesh her a puppy anyway..."


    Ha! That's going to be my strategy too....
  • edited November -1
    I tell ya it works! That's how I got the boys. Took a good two alcohol infused trips to the breeder, but it was worth it.
  • edited November -1
    Thus far, I like where this convo is going.

    What's better than liqour & puppies??? :D ~
  • edited November -1
    Puppies are great...for those who are capable and willing to establish all the ground-work and rearing of a puppy into a well-balanced, socialized dog.


    I actually have a person interested in a puppy for security work BUT he does not necessarily want to spend the time rasing a "child". He wants to be put on a waiting list for a puppy and he will pay for puppy in FULL. However, he doesn't want to take the dog home until he is between the age of 12-24 months (1-2 years) and ready to start security work. He'd rather the breeder keep the puppy and raise him for him or pawn the dog to some other home where he can grow up until he is ready to begin "his job".


    So...some people would rather have an older puppy or dog to start with and those dogs CAN still bond with their actual owners. Some people may not have the time to raise a puppy or just don't want to deal with it, ya know?


    And it's okay if this half-grown puppy still lives with his or her parents (he'll be learning the ways of the doggie rituals and perhaps it's best that she learns from a trusted family member then an unknown stranger dog =])...so long as that dog has one on one training sessions and outings with the breeder or a trusted friend/family member/trainer buddy. And continued exposure to randoms and other people. Shouldn't be any difference unless of course these pups are left to live their lives in kennel runs with only his/her parents/syblings until rehomed or placed then yeah...I could see this being a big problem. Dogs need regular field trips, especially puppies! And most dogs like to live inside the house with the peoples.


    ----------------------------------

    HAHAH, Chrystal! What if this breeder does not drink wine and stuff? Do you have a back-up Plan B?
  • edited March 2010
    Corina - Everyone has their poison!!! ~
  • edited November -1
    Corina- that reminds me of puppy raisers for guide dogs. As far as I know- which isn't very far- guide dog rejects are raised very well in terms of socialization and exposure and training, so even if you get one that fails at several months they have had an enriched, loving puppyhood. Are guide dogs in training barred from playing with other dogs or anything? Off leash? IS there anything in their puppy raising that you arent allowed to do, lest it make them less able to orient to the handler? Are there similar police dog raisers?

    -----
    hmm...plan B....PUPPETS!

    I delivered several of my graduate course presentations with great success via making and performing with animal hand puppets. Plan B is to deliver my "puppy application" via puppets. maybe that should be plan A. I rankle at filling out forms with lines and boxes.
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