Shikokus and Shibas
Just to start - I swear I have read the Breed Temperament comparison list, and loads of other things before asking this.
Also the answer to this might in part just be the fact that individual dogs have their own personalities. Anyway:
I am really leaning toward getting a Shikoku breed, they sound fantastic and right for my lifestyle from everything I've read so far. However, there is one thing that is confusing me, which seems to be a contradiction, so I'm pretty sure I'm missing something.
On a number of threads I've seen people saying that Shikokus are not good for a first time owner, and they would be much better suited for a Shiba (or Akita, but I'm not really interested in them. Too big.) My question is why?
In a few places on these forums I've seen comparisons of the breeds, and mostly I've gathered the idea that Shikokus are: Easier to train than a Shiba, more affectionate, more loyal, better around strangers (and maybe other dogs) and possibly more open to being stroked (although not entirely certain on that one).
If this is the case, why are Shibas frequently recommended as an easier starting breed? The only thing that seems certain, is that Shikokus have more energy, but I don't think that's got much to do with whether you are a first time owner or not, that seems more to do with your lifestyle.
Thanks for the help.
Also the answer to this might in part just be the fact that individual dogs have their own personalities. Anyway:
I am really leaning toward getting a Shikoku breed, they sound fantastic and right for my lifestyle from everything I've read so far. However, there is one thing that is confusing me, which seems to be a contradiction, so I'm pretty sure I'm missing something.
On a number of threads I've seen people saying that Shikokus are not good for a first time owner, and they would be much better suited for a Shiba (or Akita, but I'm not really interested in them. Too big.) My question is why?
In a few places on these forums I've seen comparisons of the breeds, and mostly I've gathered the idea that Shikokus are: Easier to train than a Shiba, more affectionate, more loyal, better around strangers (and maybe other dogs) and possibly more open to being stroked (although not entirely certain on that one).
If this is the case, why are Shibas frequently recommended as an easier starting breed? The only thing that seems certain, is that Shikokus have more energy, but I don't think that's got much to do with whether you are a first time owner or not, that seems more to do with your lifestyle.
Thanks for the help.
Comments
I have heard many times people say the same thing about a shiba...not good for first time dog owner. It is really up to the individual person.
>> IMHO, all of the NK breeds are uniquely eccentric in their own way. First-time dog owner or long-time dog owner I think would find that their NK is uniquely difficult in one way or another, not impossible or unrealistically difficult tho. I agree with the others, an educated person could take on any of the NK as a first time owner. My wife and I did, and we survived, and we aren't special.
In a few places on these forums I've seen comparisons of the breeds, and mostly I've gathered the idea that Shikokus are: Easier to train than a Shiba, more affectionate, more loyal, better around strangers (and maybe other dogs) and possibly more open to being stroked (although not entirely certain on that one).
>> I would agree with all this except the loyalty thing and the better with other dogs thing, Shikoku seem pretty stoked to hang out with anyone so I dunno how loyal they are... but I DO NOT think Shikoku are better with other dogs than the other NK. Shikoku can be pretty horrible with other dogs at times. I do think they are more social (they want to be with other dogs) than Shiba tho.
If this is the case, why are Shibas frequently recommended as an easier starting breed? The only thing that seems certain, is that Shikokus have more energy, but I don't think that's got much to do with whether you are a first time owner or not, that seems more to do with your lifestyle.
>> I don't think Shikoku have more energy than Shiba, I think Shikoku have more drive than Shiba. Shikoku don't go zooming around the house like freaks as often as Shiba, but Shikoku will not stop if it wants something, they are tenacious in their relentlessness, and maybe that can be seen as high energy, but I think its more an indication of drive than energy level.
----
If possible I'll try to see some before finally making a decision, but I'm not sure if there are any UK owners of the Shikoku. Is anyone aware of any on here? Most of the posters I've come across seem to be from America, but that probably isn't everone.
Brad - you're right, the information did say it was a higher drive, not greater energy levels. Think I merged the two things together in my mind, but I can see that they are quite separate.
I had a meeting on Friday with Dr. Barbera Sherman who is the president of the American College of Veterinary Behaviorists. We spoke at length about some work we are going to do together, but at some point in the conversation I mentioned that 4 years ago I had gotten a Shiba as my first dog ever. She was incredulous. She thought I was completely crazy. So this is someone who has a clinical practice that deals with behavior problems in dogs from all around the state and a few neighboring states, is intimately familiar with cutting edge academic research on dog behavior, and is telling me I'm crazy for getting a Shiba as my first dog.
I have to say that I came across similar things when I was looking at getting tropical fish. Everything seemed to suggest that whatever fish I wanted, it was probably too complex for a first fish, and would die instantly without experience.
After doing loads of research, cycling the tank and so on, I got the fish anyway. 3 years later, they are all still alive.
Honestly, I think a lot of the "not for a novice owner" stuff is just people being protective of the animals they love. I know I do it. When people ask me about my Shibas on the street, I paint them in the worst light possible.
In reality, if you are here doing research and willing to wait a year or more for the breed of dog you want, odds are you can handle whatever you decide to get. It's all a matter of dedication. Those cautionary tails are mainly for the people who read one webpage about a breed and want to buy one tomorrow. Ya know?
Mostly I agree with what's been said here....the cautionary "tails" *lol* are for those who aren't going to be dedicated to the dog. and it's important to hear warnings so people know what they're getting into, but if you're prepared, it simply doesn't make sense to say get a Shiba first when you want a Shikoku...Esp. because then you have a Shiba! Who most likely will be VERY resentful about the new addition to the house.
Dave, is it you who calls the Shibas "punkassed"? I can't remember who says it now, but it has become my favorite description of Shibas...
I'm sure some breeds are much harder to have than others, regardless of whether they are your first or not. And I know that no matter how much I read, it won't really be a substitute for experience. Just wondering what you would consider a major/possibly insurmountable problem.
Just wanted to emphasise again that I wasn't looking to cause strife with the breed examples question, was just wondering. I think I'll start a slightly better phrased question on a different thread to get at what I meant.