Dog Boxes and Trailers
I know that most people who hunt here probably don't use dog boxes/trailers, but maybe you know someone who does...
I have a plan! I've been thinking about it and musing over it for a year, but now its time to put it into action. I want to build a trailer that is 1/2 dog trailer and 1/2 travel trailer. My plan is to build or buy a little teardrop I can tow with my PT Cruiser and fill one side of it with hunting dog boxes. The boxes will be on a "pop out" for when I make camp, in order to have more sleeping space inside. [Ideally the boxes will be removable and fit in the bed of my husband's truck, but not necessary.]
I know how big my trailer will be: 4' wide x 8' long x 4' tall at its highest point. What I don't know is how big the dog boxes need to be!
I have tried in vain to find minimum dimensions of a dog box based on the height of the dog. I have found a ton of manufacturers and plenty of places which will custom build dog boxes for you. The sites list the dimensions of each stall, but not the size of dog that its suited for.
This thread indicates that 18" to 19" is sufficient for a 24" (at the shoulder), 65lb dog: http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=385468. Does that seem right? I know that dog boxes are typically much smaller than the wire crates we use at night or the plastic carriers we use for airline travel. I just don't know how small is okay.
Right now I am considering building my boxes 4" shorter than my dogs' shoulders. That will give me some 20" and 22" boxes. I have one design sketched that allows for a single 26" tall box if necessary, but it necessitates having at least one box that is only 18" tall.
I have a plan! I've been thinking about it and musing over it for a year, but now its time to put it into action. I want to build a trailer that is 1/2 dog trailer and 1/2 travel trailer. My plan is to build or buy a little teardrop I can tow with my PT Cruiser and fill one side of it with hunting dog boxes. The boxes will be on a "pop out" for when I make camp, in order to have more sleeping space inside. [Ideally the boxes will be removable and fit in the bed of my husband's truck, but not necessary.]
I know how big my trailer will be: 4' wide x 8' long x 4' tall at its highest point. What I don't know is how big the dog boxes need to be!
I have tried in vain to find minimum dimensions of a dog box based on the height of the dog. I have found a ton of manufacturers and plenty of places which will custom build dog boxes for you. The sites list the dimensions of each stall, but not the size of dog that its suited for.
This thread indicates that 18" to 19" is sufficient for a 24" (at the shoulder), 65lb dog: http://www.michigan-sportsman.com/forum/showthread.php?t=385468. Does that seem right? I know that dog boxes are typically much smaller than the wire crates we use at night or the plastic carriers we use for airline travel. I just don't know how small is okay.
Right now I am considering building my boxes 4" shorter than my dogs' shoulders. That will give me some 20" and 22" boxes. I have one design sketched that allows for a single 26" tall box if necessary, but it necessitates having at least one box that is only 18" tall.
Comments
That being said, I don't think you'll be able to make your setup work. A 4'x8'x4' trailer is TINY! The smallest travel trailers are 16 feet. The monsters top out around 35'. Candice and I rented one last summer that was 26' and it was a bit cramped with two Shibas and a Kai, but doable. I'm in the market for a 35 footer now.
That being said, I think your bigger problem than size is going to be the tow capacity of your PT Cruiser. That 4x8x4 trailer you are talking about is likely to weigh far more than your Cruiser can safely tow. One of the big problems in the trailer world is that tow ratings of vehicles is not the important number to pay attention to, it is payload capacity. For example, my previous truck (a 2010 F-150) had a tow rating of 9,200lb but a payload capacity of 1100lb. A properly setup bumper-pull trailer will put 13% of it's weight on the hitch. A 9,200 pound trailer would already put me 96 pounds over my payload capacity. And that 1100 pounds is BEFORE I put gas in the 36 gallon tank, factored in my fat ass, Candice and the pups. In reality, I had room for 400 pounds of payload, which meant a 3,076lb trailer. Basically a boat. Not an RV trailer. My suspicion is that if you do the math for you PT Cruiser, you're going to find a realistic safe trailer weight is probably about 2,500lb. Which is probably going to be the weight of the frame of your 4x8x4 trailer alone. Forget the 1,000+ pounds of dog box you are talking about putting in there. Or travel trailer amenities.
Sorry if that's not what you wanted to hear. :-(
http://www.chaletrv.com/folding_ltw.php
So I'm not much help either....I do know that the dog boxes I've seen are small because they don't intend to leave the dog in there that long (and @Dave, yeah, having dogs spend that much time in them would be awful!)
eta: crossposted with ayk. I love that little trailer! I think we have too many dogs though!
I decided on the teardrop for aesthetic reasons; it looks awesome with a Cruiser. Teardrops are a traditional DIY project and there's dozens of plans available freely online. The sketch I referred to was done using the Superleggera teardrop trailer plan, and I know very well how small it is and that it will work. I've imported the plans into Google SketchUp so I can have a "hands on" look at it. [This is how I designed my full-scale TARDIS built by my friend last year.]
If the dog box is 1,000lbs I'm doing something very, very wrong. The prebuilt boxes and custom jobs I've seen people do were around 85lbs to 100lbs for a double box.
EDIT: Here's one of the forums I've been perusing for tiny travel trailers - http://www.tnttt.com/
EDIT x2: Here is the Superleggera I was talking about - http://www.angib.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/teardrop/tear32.htm it has a link to weight estimate for materials.
EDIT x3: I also have to keep it at 1000lbs for legal reasons. I forget what those were. Probably insurance or brake lights or something.
@shibamistress I have thought about the fact that I'll have to pick the dogs up. I don't have a great answer to that, except that I do lift and carry my dogs regularly - especially the girls. I would be putting my larger dogs in the bottom, which should be no worse than lifting them into the back of my car. I could maybe get a doggy truck ramp though...
I want the dogs to have enough space to turn around and change positions, so the type of box used by mushers would be too small. I've read that for safety reasons hunters prefer that their dogs aren't able to stand up while driving, but I don't know how much height they need to turn around in a crouch.
http://www.golittleguy.com/teardrops/models/4-wide-platform/
This is very similar to the Superlegerra plans. I think it has bigger wheels and obviously is heaver.
So the ultimate purpose is for multi-day shows? Drive up with the dogs in the car, set-up in the RV areas, and then the dogs and the single driver would sleep in the teardrop?
Are dog boxes really cool enough for a double-coated breed to stay in? Even in daytime CA? I don't have any experience with them so I wouldn't know.
The ultimate purpose is to be able to take road trips with the dogs. My options for lodging when traveling with 2-3 Akitas are very limited. I like to stay in KOA campgrounds as much as possible (so much cheaper than hotels!) but I want the option to stay at a KOA that doesn't have cabins and don't want to sleep on the ground in a tent. A trailer also lets me pull over and just sleep on the side of the road if I have to - if I over-extended myself, have car troubles, etc.
Whats more, I simply can't fit 3+ Akitas in my car (or my mother's Prius) if any of them have to be crated because they're in heat, don't get along, etc. There's just no room; I need a trailer. I am told its not safe for the dogs to be loose in the back of a car, as well.
The dogs will only be in the boxes while driving, and I would stop frequently to let them run and relieve themselves. At night I'd set up normal crates outside under my ez-up tent or open up all the dog box doors on the inside of the trailer and let them sleep on/with me.
Another benefit of a tiny trailer like the ones I am considering is that it can be maneuvered by hand without a donkey. I could roll the trailer across the grass to my spot at a dog show and unpack the dogs, crates, chairs, and tent in place. I'd even have a galley to eat lunch at and sit around!
I really don't plan to stay in RV areas for multi-day dog shows, but that would be an option. Generally speaking, however, I would stay at a hotel at the final destination.
As for the heat - I think the ventilation and insulation of a travel trailer will be better than your standard dog trailer. I plan to have the inside of the boxes use "jail bar" style walls to help with airflow. The CampInn brand teardrop trailers have optional AC inside, so I may look into adding one as well.
Labradors are double-coated and the best info I have found about dog boxes for larger breeds was on a Labrador forum, so obviously they use them.
TLDR: The trailer is for traveling and transporting the dogs, not for camping at the final destination.
http://www.streetrod-trailers.com/roadster.html
I doubt I could make it safe for dogs. But its adorable!
As for the weight of the dog box, the ones I've come across are all diamond plate and very heavy. A 2 hole box typically starts around 650lb. I'm not sure what an 85lb box would look like, but I suspect it would be pretty flimsy.
I have to think about transporting more dogs, too, but I think I'll be going with a van or mini-van and modifying it. Probably the mini-van. My brother's older Odessey still gets 28 mpg, and I like how the AC is spread all throughout the interior. (PS is very adverse to being hot.) I'm pretty sure I can squeeze in to sleep if I need to, and the higher roof won't make it so claustrophobic for me.
I'll have to be a more hard-core dog person to do what my Malamute friend did. In addition to that A-frame, she has a modified full-size van. At the last picnic it transported 6 plastic crates, 2 assembled wire crates, 4 folded x-pens with tops, and of course a dolly to move things from the parking lot to the grassy picnic area. If she didn't have the super-huge ice chest and EZ-up packed in, she would still have room to take a nap in the van. If we're ever at the same location on the same day, I'll show her van to you. :-)
I like the teardrop idea too, and the van idea is even cooler....I might as well dream, right!
@ayk I'd love a van, but it doesn't give me the versatility I want - and will cost more money to buy a van and require more money over the long term to keep up its registration, smog checks, insurance, and gas. All vehicles will eventually "die" but a trailer, lacking an engine or working parts of any kind can outlast quite a few cars with good upkeep.
The major downside, of course, is that I have to learn how to drive and park with a trailer. But my parents are "trailer people" and have been driving and towing trailers for twice as long as I've been alive. They can teach me, and I will be going to them every step of the way in my planning process to make sure I am doing things right.
Do you think these crates are big enough?
http://www.nihonken.org/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/7454/my-traveldog-trailer.../#Item_2