My Hokkaido Experience with Kita Yume
Hi everyone,
I was just reading Krisz's post about her experience with Hokkaidos and wanted to throw in mine.
Yume (bitch) has been a handful to say the least. She will be 3 this coming January and this is what I have found.
First of all is pretty good with Kazuko (my wife) and , but I would absolutely NOT trust her around other people, she will bite! It is funny because I was warned by a Akita breeder about Hokkaidos, but I thought he was just trying to sell me an Akita. As I said she is mostly good with us, but still mouthy and does not hesitate to nip at me whenever she wants something.
* If you are thinking about a Hokkaido please remember you may be in a situation where children and other people are not welcome in your home.
The next thing is her prey drive which is totally off the charts. She is a hunter and goes into hunting mode as soon as she smells something which is pretty much always, She discovered a cat across from our house and she is totally obsessed with it. She chewed a hole in our blinds so she can peer out and watch for the cat and when she sees it all hell breaks loose.
She has managed to kill a few squirrels, birds and is also a great mouse hunter. She hunts mice in the grass or under the snow and does it exactly the way a fox does, pretty cool actually.
Also, she is not very good with other dogs. We socialized her so much as a pup, but as she got older play fighting would easily turn into a fight and now if for some reason she doesn't like the other dog she is very much the aggressor and will really attack the other dog.
Finally, it took a while, but after a year or so became much more affectionate to us and does always want to be close by. I wanted a dog that would love the outdoors, be a bit of a guard dog and an overall good companion. I got what I wanted, but have to work very hard to keep her away from other dogs and also people which can be stressful sometimes. Yume is so cute and people think she must be gentle so we have to be very careful not to let people try to touch her or I am afraid we will have a law suit on our hands.
So, yes we love Yume and love having her, but I would NOT recommend this breed if you have or are thinking of having children or if you like to entertain at home. They are a lot of work and need to be carefully monitored.
If anyone has any questions I would be happy to answer.
I was just reading Krisz's post about her experience with Hokkaidos and wanted to throw in mine.
Yume (bitch) has been a handful to say the least. She will be 3 this coming January and this is what I have found.
First of all is pretty good with Kazuko (my wife) and , but I would absolutely NOT trust her around other people, she will bite! It is funny because I was warned by a Akita breeder about Hokkaidos, but I thought he was just trying to sell me an Akita. As I said she is mostly good with us, but still mouthy and does not hesitate to nip at me whenever she wants something.
* If you are thinking about a Hokkaido please remember you may be in a situation where children and other people are not welcome in your home.
The next thing is her prey drive which is totally off the charts. She is a hunter and goes into hunting mode as soon as she smells something which is pretty much always, She discovered a cat across from our house and she is totally obsessed with it. She chewed a hole in our blinds so she can peer out and watch for the cat and when she sees it all hell breaks loose.
She has managed to kill a few squirrels, birds and is also a great mouse hunter. She hunts mice in the grass or under the snow and does it exactly the way a fox does, pretty cool actually.
Also, she is not very good with other dogs. We socialized her so much as a pup, but as she got older play fighting would easily turn into a fight and now if for some reason she doesn't like the other dog she is very much the aggressor and will really attack the other dog.
Finally, it took a while, but after a year or so became much more affectionate to us and does always want to be close by. I wanted a dog that would love the outdoors, be a bit of a guard dog and an overall good companion. I got what I wanted, but have to work very hard to keep her away from other dogs and also people which can be stressful sometimes. Yume is so cute and people think she must be gentle so we have to be very careful not to let people try to touch her or I am afraid we will have a law suit on our hands.
So, yes we love Yume and love having her, but I would NOT recommend this breed if you have or are thinking of having children or if you like to entertain at home. They are a lot of work and need to be carefully monitored.
If anyone has any questions I would be happy to answer.
Comments
I will say that they are exuberant greeters and mouthy, but it is a joyful expression imo and no more over the top than Kishu or Shikoku or Shiba. Have you had her thyroid checked? I can see how puppies that are not well socialized could definilty become fear biters, but that is totally not something I would consider to be "normal" with this breed. At least not with my girl (she loves people).
That's too bad, I'm sorry you are having trouble with her...it's been a long time since you posted. I assume she is spayed?
This link might help with being able to share photos from Flickr. One user mentions that when you copy the embed information if you change "true" to "false" it might work.
So isntead of this...
< a data-flickr-embed="true"
You'd do this?
< a data-flickr-embed="false"
Which seems to work from me (sorry for the Meitou photo).
I also noticed that in the embed code is the code with the "img src" tag and I just discovered that if I copy and paste just that part it also works.
--
Anyway, I'm sorry to hear that Yume has been pretty tough. In some ways Meitou has been pretty tough, too, so I feel you on that bit. Although in some areas Yume does sound like she might be more difficult in some areas. Maybe I should write a "life with Hokkaido" post, too, just to get more information out there.
I haven't followed Yume's story closely, but have you ever consulted with a CAAB about her behavior? When I realized TK bites strangers after getting him, I went and just had a consult to get a professional, educated opinion and a game plan. I haven't found it particularly difficult to keep him away from strangers or dogs, I guess - but then again, my first dog was a VERY dog-aggressive Malamute with resource guarding issues. The NK are all significantly smaller than that, so I know my opinion on what is "difficult" is skewed.
I don't think the breed should be generalized from the habits/behavior of one individual. If I told people to expect Shikoku to be like TK, everyone would think they were dangerous man-eaters... and that just isn't the case. That said, it's good to have your experiences with Yume out there in the open.
I've absolutely adored every Hokkaido I have met - even Katana, who barked right in my face and ran away. Genko, from my experience, is not like Yume at all - and Meitou, despite warnings, has been nothing but a gentleman as far as I can see.
@jeffnkazuko I know you outlined a lot of difficulties about Yume in your original post. And you did mention she got more affectionate as she got older. Maybe you could also provide some of the fun things you've done with Yume? Sometimes it is useful for people interested in the breed to know, say, what sorts of activities a dog enjoys, etc.?
I feel like I make TK out to be a bigger monster than he is... but that's because he has and will bite strangers and he does draw blood if he can... so I'd rather paint him villainous than see someone come in and get hurt.
I said even with her troubles we really enjoy having her. We take her pretty much everywhere with us and she loves getting into the woods or mountains and even loves riding in the canoe.
Her two big downfalls are her prey drive and her obsessiveness. Here is the best example I can think of.
Yume noticed a cat outside once which put her into a mad frenzy of howling and almost smashing through a window to get it. Since then she has chewed a whole in the upstairs and downstairs blinds so she can sit and watch for the cat, I mean she will try to stay awake all night looking for this damn cat and of course when she sees it goes crazy again. Yesterday, I saw the cat was standing on top of our fence looking into our yard. The fence is just over 6 feet tall and when Yume noticed the cat she unbelievably almost got it. I can't believe how high she jumped and was trying to claw into the wood to get higher, damn cat was pretty surprised as well. Now of course she wants to go out and stare at the top of the fence all day.
The same goes when we get into the woods for a hike, she just wants to track something, yesterday she was going nuts as we got back to my truck, but I didn't see anything around and of course about 100 meters up the road were 3 whitetails which again drives her into a mad Hokkaido howling session.
Anyway as I said she is very challenging, but we love having her. We don't have kids or a lot of people coming over so it isn't too bad. I don't want to criticize the whole breed, but when I was in Hokkaido most owners told us not to try to get too close to their dogs. I am sure this was to prevent losing a finger to two.
I think the worst was over my road trip to California when they both took off after a critter on mount Shasta. One jumped right out of the Jeep window to give chase.
Fortuneately, my Kishu are very people-friendly to offset their intensity. My Shikoku, by comparison, isn't as intense as my Kishu, but WILL hurt strangers if given the chance.
I think with all the bad publicity on the Hokkaido breed, people are just a little twitchy and sensitive about when more is written or put out there.
And lol! I love the pictures of her with her head in the holes. LooKS like a familiar sight, to me - my younger Kishu is always sticking her face in holes she finds or creates.
I think that some of this behavior is inherent to the medium sized breeds, and the closer the breed/individual is to its roots, the stronger/more intense the behavior. That's a big generalization, tho.
@Kaja I can't really speak for all Hokkaido, since my size sampling is small (Meitou, Genko, and Genko's puppies). And I mostly speak from my experience with Meitou since I've only met Genko twice (and puppies are just sweet puppies!).
From my experience, I like the Hokkaidio personality though meitou's reactivity has stressed me out a lot (not as badly now that I've had some help from trainers, but still does to an extent). I would still be open to owning another Hokkaido down the line, but I have several family members who are convinced I should never own another even though they do like Meitou a lot.
Meitou is very friendly with his people and people he knows SUPER well or likes a lot. And as long as people obey the rule of "do not pet him" until Meitou gives a pretty clear indication (to me) that others can pet him then he's actually fine around people. I've taken him to an anime convention with huge crowds and he has done great. He really doesn't care than much about people unless they invade his space. So, friendly, but with stipulations. On the flip side, from what I have seen of Genko, she's much more friendly. She also will steal your chicken treats all day long if you let her.
Meitou is in it for himself, but he does seem willing to do things I ask. He isn't a people-pleaser like my Border Collie was, but he is actually very happy to work with me and learn things and he has been pretty easy to train in a lot of ways. He picked up his wave trick after watching my Border Collie do it once. Granted, some things are tougher for training--like his reactivity to other dogs--but even then he hasn't been too bad. Once we got into it he picked up on behaviors really quickly there. There are certain spots in my neighborhood where there are what I call the "dog hot spots." Basically the houses that have annoying dog tendencies *they're out loose, they rush Meitou, they bark at him a lot). Meitou is like an elephant and never forgets, but in some of these places where he has been getting treats he will now look at me expectantly, waiting for his treats as we walk down the road....even when there aren't any dogs! He's figured out they are "treat spots," lol. So yeah, he's smart and willing to work but he can be pretty stubborn if he wants to be.
I remember someone saying previously on the forum...@TheWalrus maybe... that show line Hokkaido in Japan are bred to be a bit more reactive because it is impressive in the ring? I don't remember exactly so don't quote me on that.
So Hokkaido are majorly wonderful, but they are also be majorly demonic, lol.
Edited a bunch because I kept forgetting words. *sigh*
Yume won't go out of her way to pick a fight with a dog, but she is always the instigator when it happens and never for any apparent reason. She also has that elephant memory and was easy to train, but getting her to do something isn't all that easy. If there is nothing in it for her she rarely listens. Have a great treat in your hand and she will follow your commands like a soldier.
Crispy: That video is EXACTLY Yume! Every time she sees a cat, rabbit, deer or whatever she goes crazy just like that. It take a good while to get her to calm down afterward as well, her heart races and to be honest I feel sorry for her. Yume almost jumped out the window of my car the other day as well. We were going up a hill and Yume notice 3 deer grazing and decided to chase them!
Dogs are such fun!!
I'd make sure she was 10-15ft away from it, pulling and very intense, but the moment she broke her focus on it, and looked back at me for a second, I took my foot off the long line and let her have it. I gradually asked for more.. her stepping towards me, coming half way towards me, coming all the way towards me, etc.
needless to say i trained her to be a killer by listening to me.
She does constantly surprise me however. Once she was out of heat and puppies were weaned, she really settled down and really craves interactions with the other dogs and people. She sleeps happily in a crate at night, goes on errands with me during the day, and is a great playmate for the younger dogs here. If my schedule allows this fall, I think she would be a fantastic agility/flyball dog since I don't have to worry about her bringing bugs home to the puppies now.
In spite of her drawbacks, which are few imo (the biggest is barrier frustration/anxiety which has improved immensely during her slow integration here) I'm really glad that she was bred and given the chance to pass on her very social temperament to her puppies. Umma, her daughter and Retar her male puppy, have very social dispositions and I hope they can carry on the line and produce Hokkaido with steady friendly natures. A couple of the puppies are a little more hesitant, but not excessively so, and have other nice features that help me to overlook them being a bit shy, such as not being very vocal and being more laid back.
Most are outgoing and all are sweet, but it will be up to their new owners to keep up with socializing them and working on impulse control. The people local to me who are getting puppies were required to have private training in place before purchase and those homes were more than happy to do that, so I think that will really help get the puppies and owners on the right path and equipped to deal with issues that arise. Time will tell. Anyways, I think there is naturally going to be a range in temperaments for this breed, as with the other breeds, and it will be up to the fanciers here to select for the traits that work for owners here, with respect to what is "correct" in Japan. I am pretty sure what I want to see more of in the breed in terms of temperament...I'm glad that Genko can be a part of that, and Yezo too. He's a doll.
Things I would change: greater impulse control and reduced barrier frustration/separation anxiety. Also, Hokkaido puppies (at least 6 all at once) have been a challenge to house train. They are puppy pad trained, but nowhere near as tidy as Shiba puppies of the same age and they do make quite a mess overnight.
But OMG they are easy-peasy to bathe and groom compared to Shibas.
@JeffnKazuko - maybe you can look into lure coursing with Yume? It's a great sport for them to have a bit of fun at and burn some energy/use their drive. I was really nervous to have Nami off leash when we tried it, but it worked out well for us. And there's no real interaction with people except for you!
LOL @ayk, I was thinking the same thing
Example - here's my Shiba's first time lure coursing
@lindsayt, it's really cool to hear about your experiences with Genko's litter. I always love the comparisons to the Shibas!
For the rarer breeds, I'm curious how a Western interpretation of character is changing them. I definitely have opinions on what temperament quirks I find undesirable.
Meitou also has quite a bit of anxiety (medication has helped some), but I also feel like he picks up AMAZINGLY well on any emotionas I am feeling, including anxiety. So we're like some sort of infinity loop feeding off one another's anxiety if I'm not careful, lol. And I do think he has some barrier frustration issues to some degree.
@jeffnkazuko Out of curiosity, how does Yume do at the vet? I'm just wondering because Meitou is a heinous monster with vets.
@zandrame I agree with @WrylyBrindle Your discussion idea sounds interesting!
"For the rarer breeds, I'm curious how a Western interpretation of character is changing them. I definitely have opinions on what temperament quirks I find undesirable."
This would be a fun topic to discuss!
I could continue here about my experience with the Hokkaido litter to date, or I can make a new thread so as not to derail.