# Shiba itching Hello Everyone! WE NEED HELP! Our precious baby is having a problem that NO ONE can seem to help us figure out! We bought her from the breeder in Missouri (Yes we realize now BAD CALL) and about two weeks later she started itching... and by itching I mean scratching to the point where she is no lon… ## Thread In Shiba Inu · started by Kitacream · 23 replies - **Category:** [Shiba Inu](https://nihonken.org/community/c/shiba-inu) - **Forum:** [Nihon Ken Forum](https://nihonken.org/community/) ## Kitacream · 2008-09-12T19:28:09.000Z Hello Everyone! WE NEED HELP! Our precious baby is having a problem that NO ONE can seem to help us figure out! We bought her from the breeder in Missouri (Yes we realize now BAD CALL) and about two weeks later she started itching... and by itching I mean scratching to the point where she is no longer the cute fluff ball she was. We have spent over $500 dollars at the vet trying to figure out what is going on and nothing is surfacing as the issue. We have done skin graphs to test her skin (all have come back normal), we have treated her for mites (in case that was the cause), we have treated her for fleas (to prevent that if it was somehow fleas we couldn't see), we have special hypo allergenic shampoo (which we only have used once to try and see if maybe some previously used soap was effecting it), we have now put her on hypo allergenic food.... and she is still itching- less but still. The week before it started we took her to the beach to go camping, and around the same time started her in puppy training class which we were told to switch her to beef jerky treats because they were easier to break apart. (The National Shiba Inu Association told me that they CANNOT have beef- which we already removed that from her diet). We have placed her completely only on the food she came with (Nutromax and animal crackers) and she still continued to itch and at which point switched her to the hypo-food. They also told me that Shiba's can be very allergic to fertilizer... which we would take her to go potty at a little yard next door that our neighbors dont use (mostly dry grass stuff- nothing green except for weeds and dandilions) so we stoped taking her there and as said before... the itching continues. We just really need any and all advice any one has- the association doesn't think it is her food and really doesn't think it is JUST because she is a cream because if so the symtoms would have been instant- not two weeks later? Anyway, she is growing hair because the tiny spots where the skin graphs were done have grown back as well as when they had her on Temeril the itching stoped too. PLEASE HELP IF YOU CAN- and sorry that this may be a little randomly written, im at work. -Kitacream We are at a loss and really need help- ## Kaddy · 2008-09-12T19:40:30.000Z Per the advice of a lot of different people, I've switched to a grain free food. I don't know if your new food has grain in it or not (and I'm very much NOT an expert on this, never having experienced it), but maybe this is something to take into consideration? I know there are many more knowledgeable people on this forum that can't offer better advice and 'why' you should eliminate grain from their diet. This is the food I switched to - it's one of the highest rated on the dog food rating forum. http://www.dogfoodanalysis.com/dog\_food\_reviews/showproduct.php?product=1602&cat=8 (Obviously it's not a cheap dog food, but I feel better knowing it's better for my baby) ## ljowen123 (moderator) · 2008-09-12T19:40:31.000Z There can be lots of reasons for the itching, as I'm sure you are finding out - Jazz has sensitive skin and is on a grain-free food rotation. In addition to her food, she gets fish oil added and a raw egg once a week. Finally, after 6 months I am seeing hair regrowth - the itching stopped within the first month. Brad, Brandon, SnF, Jen, Jessica, and I think Romi have all posted dealing with issues such as these - there are allergy test and lots of things that can be done. In my case, I knew Jazz had an allergy in food that was causing the itching and hair loss. Do a search for itching on the search page and it will bring up the discussions that mention - there are excellent suggestions. ## Nekopan · 2008-09-12T19:45:42.000Z Had she by chance had any vaccinations before the sudden itchiness? I've heard that shibas can have extreme reactions to vaccines. ## kwyld · 2008-09-13T00:11:08.000Z A board certified dermatologist would be your best bet in determining the root cause of your shiba's itchies. A holistic veterinarian would be very helpful too, and there are a lot of helpful theads on here as mentioned above. I would suggest feeding a better quality grain free food. Fish oil, salmon oil to be exact is very beneficial for the skin and other organs and reduces inflammation. If the skin test came back normal then I would think a food allergy would be the culprit and Dave on this forum is very knowledgable about food allergies and how strict you have to be with them. He would be the best person to talk to about how to do it. ## _dlroberts · 2008-09-13T02:11:46.000Z Hi Chelsea, I'm really sorry to hear your poor little girl is so itchy. Unfortunately, allergies of various sorts are becoming more and more common in Shibas as they become more popular. I want to re-emphasize what Kelly mentioned, taking her to a specialist is a very wise choice. My Shiba, Lucy, suffers from inflammatory bowel disease (IBD) which manifests itself as serial food allergies (among other things). I spent more money than I care to admit on repeated vet visits trying to figure out what Lucy's problem was. After about 8 months, I finally took her to see a specialist who had her diagnosed in 10 minutes (although we did do some tests to confirm the diagnosis which took longer than 10 minutes). It wasn't cheap, but if I had just gone to see a specialist from the start it would have saved me a lot of money (and heart ache) in the long run. What food do you have her on? Not all hyper-allergenic foods are created equal. Many are marketed as allergy friendly formulas but are not manufactured under the strict control necessary to prevent trace contaminations that can set off really sensitive dogs like Lucy. When you have a dog that suffers from allergies, you have to control EVERYTHING they come into contact with. If they have a topical allergy, it can be even tougher than a food allergy like Lucy's. A specialist will be better able to explain the process to you, but the idea is to eliminate all possible allergens to a point where she become stable and then add them back slowly, one at a time, until you can write down all the things that set her off. She may need the assistance of anti-histamines or steroids if her body reacts too strongly to the things she comes in contact with. It took a month or so to find the right drug and dosage for Lucy, but it made a HUGE difference for her. A specialist will be much better equipped to help you navigate the pros and cons of each of the available drugs and dosages than your normal vet. I know I haven't really provided you with an answer, but I hope I've helped shed some light on what you may be up against. Please don't hesitate to ask any questions you may have. I know more than I could have ever wanted to know about food allergies in dogs and I learned it all by asking questions. ## takumi · 2008-09-13T13:25:14.000Z My 10 month old Takumi had a big flea problem about 3 month ago. With some medications vet gave him, all fleas were gone. But I noticed his coating was getting thinner and thinner. He was losing lots of his hair. Fluffy tail he used to have was getting smaller too. That time he stll scratched himself... not as much as when he had flea problem, but he still did. The vet told me that his skin problem caused his losing hair (he pulls his hair off himself by scratchig becuase of his itchy skin). Even though I could not not see any flea in sight at all on him, the vet decieded to take complete care of flea problem. The vet gave him a spray called Knock out to apply to his body once a month and a medicated shampoo called allermyl. The vet instructed me to bathe him two times a week. I know I shouldn't bathe dogs not that often... but that's what the vet told me to do. She said that I should leave the shampoo for about 10 minutes for contact time after applying it to all over his body. This shampoo is for itchy skin and to help soothe it, she said. He also takes liquid fatty acid called Omegaderm every other day with his food. After doing these treatments for about a month, Takumi's coating has come back and his tail looks much bigger now, too. He was not diagnosed as food allergy, but I also changed his diet to grain free food called Natural Balance. http://www.naturalbalanceinc.com/dogformulas/PandD.html ## Kitacream · 2008-09-13T16:42:06.000Z WOW! You have all provided such helpful advice- THANK YOU! We are going to go into the vet this weekend and mention some of these things and see what we can do. (Side note: How do I write someone specific on here if I have a direct question for them?) I think I will post a picture today so you can all see what her current state looks like... and maybe that will help paint a picture too of what she looks like after all of this. Also, The National shiba Inu Associaton told me not to treat her for fleas because Shiba's dont actually need it because they don't have the right blood type to get fleas? I was a little thrown off by this because the vet found tiny ones on her that had just hatched and from what it sounds like some of you have had issues with them in the past. Has anyone ever heard of this? ## ivanmeza03 · 2008-09-13T16:57:46.000Z repost "All dogs raised normally by their mothers possess this mite as mites are transferred from mother to pup via cuddling during the first few days of life. Most dogs live in harmony with their mites, never suffering any consequences from being parasitized. If, however, conditions change to upset the natural equilibrium (such as some kind of suppression of the dog's immune system), the Demodex mites may "gain the upper hand." The mites proliferate and can cause serious skin disease." "Classically Demodex mites have been felt to only be transferable from mother to newborn pup. After the pup is a week or so old, it has developed enough immunity so that infection is no longer possible. In other words, after age one week or so, a dog will not longer accept new mites on its body." "Mites live inside hair follicles -- a difficult place for miticides (chemicals that kill mites) to reach." "Mites are a normal residents of dog skin; it is only in some individual dogs that mites cause problems." again, hope that helps 8) ## TeamLaika · 2008-09-13T18:28:19.000Z Kitacream: The suggestions thus far have been good. However, since you mentioned your vet found fleas...Your pooch may have a flea allergy. Some dogs (and cats) are INTENSELY allergic to FLEA SALIVA. Literally one nibble from a flea will send them into contortions and they will scratch and loose hair. For the flea allergic patient, 100% flea control is essential for the pet to remain symptom-free. You may not see them, but that doesn’t mean they aren’t there. Also, the itchy pet often scratches so much that adult fleas are removed, making them hard to find. If you take care of the fleas, no more itching. If you are in an area with ticks, try Advantix or Frontline. If you are in a tick-free zone try Advantage. The over-the-counter flea topicals are worthless. You can also ask your vet about Capstar tablets which will kill any live adult fleas that are currently on her. You might have to treat the environment too! Regardless of what the Shiba association told you, treat her for fleas. It is a simple thing to rule out. Shiba's don't have blood types different from any other dog. They are dogs and fleas like 'em! ## kwyld · 2008-09-14T13:08:50.000Z Kitacream, I hope this isn't the National Shiba Club of America giving you information such as not needing to treat your Shiba for fleas because of their blood type. That's rubbish. I tried to Google The National Shiba Inu Association and this webitse popped up www.shibas.org/clubs.html, but I can't see anyone on there telling people that sort of information. Is it this association or another one that is giving you that information? And I'm concerned about the "cannot have beef" comment. Why would they tell people a dog can't have beef for no reason. The only reason a dog can't have beef is if they are allergic to it. ## Kitacream · 2008-09-14T18:07:48.000Z Sorry the pictures are SO HUGE- I have NO IDEA what Im doing as to why they wont go smaller. Here is the one from behind... ## MommyofNiko · 2008-09-14T21:00:58.000Z umm....took me a minute to know what I was looking for and to realize that was not puppy porn. : / Dont know what to tell you but I hope she gets better! ## _dlroberts · 2008-09-14T22:06:05.000Z That pattern of hair loss is pretty common to flea allergy. Is she missing any hair on her back near the base of her tail too? ## Kitacream · 2008-09-15T01:39:56.000Z Well, she has pretty much lost hair everywhere... in person it looks a lot thinner. :( She does itch at her back a lot and chews on her legs. She has no sores or red spots anywhere... we have given her the capastar (I think that is how you spell it) as well as treated her with Advantage, we have bombed our house properly and treated our two indoor cats as well... (none are due for retreatment again for two weeks I believe). ## Kitacream · 2008-09-15T01:41:13.000Z Also, I just realized I only sent the main comment to my previous picture to a specific person: here is what went with it. It was the National Shiba Club of America who gave me this information- I spent an hour on the phone with them. :( They said all shibas are allergic to beef and should never have it in their diet... We are so lost right now and cannot seem to figure any pattern to the itching madness- She has been on medicine that included a very low dose of steroids to try and sustain the itching and while we thought she was getting better everytime we try to ween her off of it she gets worse again... implying of course that it is the medicine minimizing the itch and nothing we have done so far. UGH! We live in Oregon (portland area) and are wondering if any of you have a reccomendation of someone we can call or somewhere we can locate a vet that has worked with Shiba's and knows the breed? And/or a specialist? Also, Stupid question I'm sure but the grain free food you are refering to would imply that if there is rice in the ingredients then it is NOT grain free and we should think about taking her off of it? The food we have got was a special RX vet food that is supposed to have been created with such small components that anything in there would not be able to cause an allergic reaction.... I was reading on another thead about cortizone shots that some dogs have to have- (I cannot locate the thread now) and was wondering if anyone knew anything about this? Sorry for all the questions and thanks for all the help- were really worried. :( Here is some pictures of what she looks like... I am not sure if you can tell very well but she basically has no fluffyness to her at all and the hair just tapers her entire body. ## _dlroberts · 2008-09-15T01:55:47.000Z Awww, poor girl. My heart aches for her. :-( She is adorable. Which specific diet is she on? Is it one of the iams hydrolized diets? If so, as I understand it, that diet works well for dogs with food allergies that cause leaky gut syndrome. I haven't heard of it being used to treat skin reactions. Also, as I understand it, those diets should be a last resort after the novel protein diets have been exhausted. I think we have one other forum member from Portland, but they haven't posted in a while. If I were you, I would check out the American College of Veterinary Dermatology website. They have a list of board certified dermatologists in your area. Ask your vet for a referral and make some calls to vets on that list. You can ask them if they have experience with Shibas, although with a specialist I wouldn't be quite as concerned about them having Shiba specific experience. ## scientiste · 2008-09-15T10:24:21.000Z Im so sorry to hear this! I know how nerve-wrecking it can be for you to see her constantly scratch. It really sounds like your dog has an inhalant allergy. My Shiba, Tsuki was having the the exact same problem when we brought her home about a month ago. The vet suspected mange first - but there was no positive result on the skin scrape, and no response to ivermectin - so it was ruled out. Now they suspect it is allergies. To rule out SEASONAL allergies, we have her on a month-long tapered steroid course ( 7 days 10 mg, 7 days 5 mg, 14 days 2.5 mg) - if the itching doesnt return, the inhalant allergies were likely seasonal. If the itching returns, allergy testing follows, followed by desensitization shots. I hope for your sake it doesn't come to this, as it all costs a pretty penny! Ill reiterate what I'm sure others have mentioned (I havent read all of the comments): -switch to grain-free food (I use orijen fresh fish) -rule out mange, with not just a skin scrape as this gives a false negative more than 50% of the time, my vet tried a treatment called ivermectin (injection) to see if she responded -take her to a veterinary dermatologist, regular vets can sometimes not be as experienced in reading allergy test results -add fish oil, it makes a significant difference for many dogs - I use human grade, two 100 mg capsules per day (I open them over her food) Best of luck to you both!!! ## brandon_w (admin) · 2008-09-15T11:14:11.000Z Also, not all Shibas are allergic to beef, that is an absurd thing to say. My Shiba eats a beef and salmon food (Solid Gold Barking at the Moon) and does excellent on it. Chicken he is allergic to. It just angers me when people make such blanket statements like that. ## lindsayt · 2008-09-15T11:30:49.000Z Hey, I haven't lived in Portland for several years, but I used to work for Companion Pet Clinic franchise, it's now Bridgecity Vet Hospital in Portland (please, don't go there, it's a heartless scam like Banfield staffing graduate vets with their thumbs you know where), but we often referred complicated cases to the specialists at Dove Lewis, an excellent ER/ICU with a sound reputation in the area. I don't think they do regular follow-up however, but are wonderful for emergencies. I personally took my dogs to Fremont Veterinary Clinic in NE which was a wonderful place with good staff. I think there is also an Allergy and Dermatology Center in SE, which may be good to check out to evaluate the allergies. Maybe you can post on the Portland Shiba Meetup site and ask where they take their pooches. Hope this helps. ## tsukitsune (moderator) · 2008-09-15T12:30:06.000Z Lots of good advice here. Shibas can SO get fleas! When we got kitsune, he was infested with fleas! The blood type insinuation is rubbish!! But shibas do seem to be particularly sensitive to allergens, flea saliva included. Especially those bred without careful consideration - they can be predisposed to all sorts of issues - including food allergies. Our Tsuki went through hell and back with us trying to figure out what ails her. She can't have kibble with chicken, beef or grains. But some Shibas can eat beef, raw or cooked. I know a few shibas on premium beef based kibble with no issues. I also know shibas on a grain kibble with no issues. As with any dog, trial and error are going to teach you so much. I second the advice to see a dermatologist. Regular Vets are great for basic care and basic diagnostics, but I would recommend seeing a specialist. I think in the end, it will actually save you and Kita time, stress and money getting a professional, specialized opinion and treatment plan. Good luck with Kita, keep us updated! ## AkiraleShiba · 2008-09-16T01:26:17.000Z I agree, try changing her food to Orijen 6 fishes or Innova Evo Red Meat or the like, I would try to avoid chicken and corn at least. I don't know why thay have told you that all shibas are allergic to beef, mine eats it but is intolerant to chicken ! Allergies are hard to determine but once you've done it at least you'll be able to keep them at bay. --- **Navigate:** [Forum home](https://nihonken.org/community/?format=md) · [Sitemap](https://nihonken.org/community/sitemap.xml)