Well, what works for one does not always for another. For us Charliebear treats have worked the best for sensitive tummies but they can be a bit boring for the average training session over time. You can always bake some treats. I believe there was a recipe area on this forum.
You can go "steak TarTare" but again you have to determine what he can digest. It is a process of trial and error. I would stick with one brand of kibble for awhile til you get some consistency in the poops. Switching around often does not necessarily allow for things to settle. Have you tried probiotics in the food? Fortiflora by Purina has worked for some. We did not have the greatest results with it but you never know if it will help you though.
An unprofessional suggestion would be warm boiled chicken is stinky enough to get his attention and not wreck his stomach. Just grab some of the frozen chicken breasts pack at a Costco, boil one and slice/dice/pull one whenever you feel the need to do a training session with him.
Jesse good idea.....Yeah chicken boiled is good. Some dogs get the "toot's" from it so be aware if he has tummy problems, probably at the lowest level he will have gas for awhile.
I like SnF's plan. It needs to be his idea to come to you in order for it to stick best. We did this Treat-Retreat thing at Suzanne's seminar- toss the treat away from you, (perhaps the leash is a cue that this game is about to begin) and he will look to you for another, allow him to take a step toward you- not you toward him!- and then toss a treat to his side or behind him. This breaks the 'tension' (for whats its worth- not saying its much tension) and allows him to not be facing off with you as he goes off to get the cheese ball. Then he decides, hey, lets see if dad has more! HE approaches YOU- that's the key. You can make this better too by moving away from him a little and he should come closer. Dont wreck your good work by picking him up or capturing him. Let the game end by releasing him to play, or playing with him, or letting him investigate the leash. After this is working well, you can invite him to follow you, and oh, we shoudl snap that leash on and here we go!
while on a walk, ditch your tall human business and meet him on Space Time- forget walking a certain distance or to any place, be WITH him and make as if your walk together is a conversation. It will be interesting to him, do "look at that" at anthills or whatever, Really be with him. If you are an interesting conversationalist, he may be more interested and not just Yes Dear you. Point to things he's probably about to sniff anyway, "Space! See this?" Check it out. You can also bring wierd things to show him- like apiece of tinfoil, or your glasses, or something he might be interested in for 3 seconds, then resume forward progress.
With our independent thinkers, we can get farther making things Their Idea rather than I Need You To Do This. The latter works great on my sis' labrador, but not so much on Sage.
---- Kyla- I love the zigzag, unpredictable routine! Though when I do the sudden stop with Sage, it backfires. He gets all alert- he thinks I saw a ghost or something and goes watchdog, defense mode. Looking for danger. Reilly knows from obedience school the stops and starts and turns and things are a game but Sage takes it way too seriously. I have to talk to him silly and stop slowly, or do turns first, then a stop. He's very literal. I have to make it very obviously a game, silly walking, teasing that I am about to step... verrrry slowly, or backwards! we are really goofy on walks sometimes!
My mom's Shiba does the exact same thing with the leash. Mine doesn't. Sadie just thinks it's a really fun game to run from the leash (although she is dying to go out).
Early on in age I find the zipzag routine sometimes causes confusion for some pups if they don't have targeting or focus down. In some cases to be effective it requires knocking into the dog to get it to align and I just don't think for a young animal that is fair or desirable. Making things unpredictable is good by having him chase/follow you as you move opposite rather than harsh stops or starts probably will be more productive at this point. Especially since there are some trust issues with him coming to you at this time.
It really depends on the dog and where you are with training. I think a good puppy basic class would help. Seeing it is worth more than a thousand words.
Snf
PS: maybe he just needs a refresher at the training center you took him to. Space has been through a lot with the surgery and all, so some classes in confidence building will help put him back on the right track. Dogs do go through several fear periods during development. If surgery falls at the same time there can be some behavior changes. Not to worry this can generally be worked out.
If you need suggestions for treats, have you considered using his food? I don't train my Shiba with treats, I just grab a cup full of his food and treat him with that.
Katsu says thank your for the teeth compliment. Her teeth are pretty nice, she actually needs a brushing this weekend. Her bite is a little overshod I think, so I guess it was good Alyssa kept Star instead of her.
She still has soft poop every once in a while. We do half and half of wellnes just for puppy and evo small red meaty bites, and a squirt of salmon oil. We've been on this for a while now and her poops are definitely firmer.
She also kind of runs sometimes from the leash. I just give her a treat when she sits and lets me put her harness and collar on. She's gotten better, she actually waited by the door this morning because she had to go out.
She pulls a little, mostly when she wants to go back inside. We're working on that.
Did you do any obedience classes with him? I feel that Katsu's classes helped alot with her confidence level, and it helpt to train US on how to teach her.
Hopefully all is going well, just stick it out. You seem as obssesed and concerned with your pups well being as any of us, I'm sure you'll work things out.
just got back from the vet with Space. Turns out he's got a very nasty ear infection. The cotton swab of his infected ear came back with a bacteria count of "too many to count". Not good.
It came on really fast. One day he was scratching his ear a bit more than normal. The next day he was shaking his head a lot. The next day there was irritation and the next blood. I was given drops and theyre gonna do a culture to find out more about his bacteria so as to prescribe the right antibiotic.
Oh well. Dogs get ear infections.
This was, however, not the worst news we were given.
It's been two weeks since the vet gave me a "wait and see" on his teeth alignment. I had him chew as much as possible during those two weeks in an effort to get them to straighten out. However, the vets updated prognosis is that he believes there is now almost no chance they will correct on their own.
He believes that without surgery or braces, they will continue go grow into the roof of his mouth causing pain, risking infection, and eating problems. Good thing I have pet insurance huh?!
Awww, Poor Space! Hopefully his ear heals soon, ear infections can get nasty quick, especially it hot/humid weather!
Hopefully the braces will get everything in line. I am going through invisilign treatment right now and let me tell you it's no picnic in the park, my teeth have been sore for weeks! Much love to Space!
So these are the likely three plans of action, according to my vet.
1) Braces This would likely be the most expensive option. From what I've read and heard it can range from $800 to $2500. Thats a big difference. I guess it goes case by case.
2) Vital Pulpotomy This would be the process of cutting the tooth down, removing the vital pulp that causes growth, and capping it. This option is cheaper, and apparently leads to no problems down the road, though I'm really not too satisfied with the idea. I'm not exactly sure of the price on this.
3) Extraction This is basically an all out bad idea according to my vet. It could lead to a ton of problems down the road.
I'll be visiting a Vet Dentist soon to get an estimate and more information. My vet is a really nice guy and mentioned that he has a Vet friend that does vital pulpotomy's for cheaper than a Vet Dentist would do. Thats always an option too.
Does anyone have any experience with these procedures?
The problem teeth are his two bottom canines, which are growing in behind his front row of teeth.
Space had his baby canines removed during his neutering because they didn't seem to have any interest in falling out themselves, and this may have led to the misalignment of the adult teeth.
I've been struggling to get a pic of this for a while, and this is the best one I got.
They warned me originally when his baby teeth were still in that if they didn't fall out on their own they should be removed or growth problems can occur.
wow that's pretty bad. Let us know what the breeder says. I also don't understand the theory behind pulling the baby teeth out in advance. Was Space having discomfort? Poor Space...and poor Mike's wallet!
The rationale from the vet was "Most vet dentists say that you never want two teeth growing for the same space at the same time". I basically just agreed and accepted this as fact. I mean it makes sense. The adult tooth should knock out the baby tooth, and if they're both there growing in the same area, it just can't be good.
Oooohhhh that does look painful. Braces will be though too. I would go with shaving down and capping, but never extraction. My braces were estimated at $6,000 but since I only had to have them on for 1 1/2 years, and you pay monthly installments for the visits over a 2 year span, it ended up being less. That may be the difference. The longer it takes to correct the issue the more you have to pay, plus the cost of the hardware. Does that make sense?
Hey Mike, what's done is done..gotta focus on the remedy now, I guess. I think Dawn mentioned Katsu may have had that done too while spaying..i THINK..
I"m sure you've thought of this already, but If you opt for braces, how will they tighten it--would they have to put him out for a bit everytime?
I think they place a retainer in certain cases on upper jaws (because I remember seeing pictures of the horribly infected mouths on the dunces that never had the retainers removed so lots of food and hair would get stuck underneath).
I don't know if a retainer for the bottom jaw would be offered to help push the teeth out for Space, I honestly haven't seen a bite like that, and well, as was said, what's done is done. I would hope that the early removal of the other teeth didn't induce that, that sort of thing needs to be done carefully. The new teeth use the hole from the old tooth as a guide from what I understand so if the teeth are resistive to come out in the first place, perhaps it wasn't yet time to remove them.
Comments
You can go "steak TarTare" but again you have to determine what he can digest. It is a process of trial and error. I would stick with one brand of kibble for awhile til you get some consistency in the poops. Switching around often does not necessarily allow for things to settle. Have you tried probiotics in the food? Fortiflora by Purina has worked for some. We did not have the greatest results with it but you never know if it will help you though.
Snf
Jesse
Snf
while on a walk, ditch your tall human business and meet him on Space Time- forget walking a certain distance or to any place, be WITH him and make as if your walk together is a conversation. It will be interesting to him, do "look at that" at anthills or whatever, Really be with him. If you are an interesting conversationalist, he may be more interested and not just Yes Dear you. Point to things he's probably about to sniff anyway, "Space! See this?" Check it out. You can also bring wierd things to show him- like apiece of tinfoil, or your glasses, or something he might be interested in for 3 seconds, then resume forward progress.
With our independent thinkers, we can get farther making things Their Idea rather than I Need You To Do This. The latter works great on my sis' labrador, but not so much on Sage.
----
Kyla- I love the zigzag, unpredictable routine! Though when I do the sudden stop with Sage, it backfires. He gets all alert- he thinks I saw a ghost or something and goes watchdog, defense mode. Looking for danger. Reilly knows from obedience school the stops and starts and turns and things are a game but Sage takes it way too seriously. I have to talk to him silly and stop slowly, or do turns first, then a stop. He's very literal.
It really depends on the dog and where you are with training. I think a good puppy basic class would help. Seeing it is worth more than a thousand words.
Snf
PS: maybe he just needs a refresher at the training center you took him to. Space has been through a lot with the surgery and all, so some classes in confidence building will help put him back on the right track. Dogs do go through several fear periods during development. If surgery falls at the same time there can be some behavior changes. Not to worry this can generally be worked out.
I don't train my Shiba with treats, I just grab a cup full of his food and treat him with that.
She still has soft poop every once in a while. We do half and half of wellnes just for puppy and evo small red meaty bites, and a squirt of salmon oil. We've been on this for a while now and her poops are definitely firmer.
She also kind of runs sometimes from the leash. I just give her a treat when she sits and lets me put her harness and collar on. She's gotten better, she actually waited by the door this morning because she had to go out.
She pulls a little, mostly when she wants to go back inside. We're working on that.
Did you do any obedience classes with him? I feel that Katsu's classes helped alot with her confidence level, and it helpt to train US on how to teach her.
Hopefully all is going well, just stick it out. You seem as obssesed and concerned with your pups well being as any of us, I'm sure you'll work things out.
just got back from the vet with Space. Turns out he's got a very nasty ear infection. The cotton swab of his infected ear came back with a bacteria count of "too many to count". Not good.
It came on really fast. One day he was scratching his ear a bit more than normal. The next day he was shaking his head a lot. The next day there was irritation and the next blood. I was given drops and theyre gonna do a culture to find out more about his bacteria so as to prescribe the right antibiotic.
Oh well. Dogs get ear infections.
This was, however, not the worst news we were given.
It's been two weeks since the vet gave me a "wait and see" on his teeth alignment. I had him chew as much as possible during those two weeks in an effort to get them to straighten out. However, the vets updated prognosis is that he believes there is now almost no chance they will correct on their own.
He believes that without surgery or braces, they will continue go grow into the roof of his mouth causing pain, risking infection, and eating problems. Good thing I have pet insurance huh?!
No. Not covered.
I am not a happy camper. I'll post more tomorrow.
Hopefully the braces will get everything in line. I am going through invisilign treatment right now and let me tell you it's no picnic in the park, my teeth have been sore for weeks! Much love to Space!
We will keep Mr. Space in our thoughts!
I am interested to how this will go...
It's his bottom canines that are too far to the middle?
1) Braces
This would likely be the most expensive option. From what I've read and heard it can range from $800 to $2500. Thats a big difference. I guess it goes case by case.
2) Vital Pulpotomy
This would be the process of cutting the tooth down, removing the vital pulp that causes growth, and capping it. This option is cheaper, and apparently leads to no problems down the road, though I'm really not too satisfied with the idea. I'm not exactly sure of the price on this.
3) Extraction
This is basically an all out bad idea according to my vet. It could lead to a ton of problems down the road.
I'll be visiting a Vet Dentist soon to get an estimate and more information.
My vet is a really nice guy and mentioned that he has a Vet friend that does vital pulpotomy's for cheaper than a Vet Dentist would do. Thats always an option too.
Does anyone have any experience with these procedures?
The problem teeth are his two bottom canines, which are growing in behind his front row of teeth.
Space had his baby canines removed during his neutering because they didn't seem to have any interest in falling out themselves, and this may have led to the misalignment of the adult teeth.
I've been struggling to get a pic of this for a while, and this is the best one I got.
Good luck going to the Vet Dentist. I didn't even know Vet Dentists existed! Shows how much I know ...
I never considered that, but I kinda doubt it.
They warned me originally when his baby teeth were still in that if they didn't fall out on their own they should be removed or growth problems can occur.
Hopefully you and the Vet Dentist can work something out to fix Space's teeth. Keep us updated with how things progress.
The rationale from the vet was "Most vet dentists say that you never want two teeth growing for the same space at the same time". I basically just agreed and accepted this as fact. I mean it makes sense. The adult tooth should knock out the baby tooth, and if they're both there growing in the same area, it just can't be good.
I"m sure you've thought of this already, but If you opt for braces, how will they tighten it--would they have to put him out for a bit everytime?
I don't know if a retainer for the bottom jaw would be offered to help push the teeth out for Space, I honestly haven't seen a bite like that, and well, as was said, what's done is done. I would hope that the early removal of the other teeth didn't induce that, that sort of thing needs to be done carefully. The new teeth use the hole from the old tooth as a guide from what I understand so if the teeth are resistive to come out in the first place, perhaps it wasn't yet time to remove them.
That really sucks Mike! Have you heard anything back from Alyssa yet?