PoongSoon the Poongsan

aykayk
edited March 2014 in Other Breeds
My dad and I picked up a Poongsan pup yesterday afternoon.

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The breed originates from an area now controlled by North Korea. In the mid-1990's, a group of pups were smuggled from North Korea to South Korea and triggered interest in the breed. Thenafter, other dogs followed, mostly now through China.

There are issues with the quality/purity of the dogs outside of North Korea. On a scale of one to ten, with ten being the best, these dogs are probably graded around 4. The North Korean military is said to have "7" dogs, the locals less so. And of course, where there's money involved, there's people who take short cuts and use mixes. Kishu, Akita, Jindo, and such.

This particular pup's lineage is via China so nothing is for sure though her parents are Korea Kennel Club registered. She's actually the last puppy in the litter to be picked up because her nose has not filled in with pigment. My guess is that with more time it will, but the skin around the nose will remain splotchy. No biggie for me since I'm not all that eager to start a line of Poongsans. They're so big compared to Jindos. Will take some time to get used to having a large dog.


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Comments

  • Wow Ann that's pretty cool. I have seen only one and that was on a travel blog by a Korean Couple.
    I will be really interesting to see how the pup matures. I hope you will keep posting pictures. Do poongsan always have floppy ears or will they straighten as the pup grows, similar to Jindos?

    Snf
  • Cute pup! Congratulations to your dad. =)
  • A good number of Poongsans, roughly about a third, won't have fully upright ears. They'll have dropped ears or tipped ears on one or both of the ears. No biggie like it is in Jindos. This girl had parents with both ears up.
  • That's really cool Ann! Please keep us updated on her development and personality, I'm really interested to hear about her!

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  • aykayk
    edited May 2011
    Well, one day into our PS experience and we've learned that she really, really hates the x-pen when it's closed. She'll go there if she wants to get away from her paparazzi (me with my flash camera), but close the gate and boy, we find out that she has a very healthy set of lungs! I've run into 2 sets of Poongsan owners that say that their adults will respect a 4 ft fence, but this little girl climbed her 2 ft x-pen last night, all the while protesting her confinement.

    Other than her complaining about her x-pen, she's very quiet and still has that puppy coordination. She's not as physically advanced as a Jindo at the same age. She likes being outdoors, but stays in the shade. Guess her puppy coat is too warm for this weather.

    She doesn't eliminate in her x-pen, but she will tinkle outside of it on the carpet. I've got to stay on top of that.

    She's shown the most interest in balls for the time being. Not so interested in squeakers. Not very food motivated yet.

    She'll follow you, but then once in a while she does the "Not yet!" and goes in a different direction. :-)

    She's taking things in stride for the moment. No reaction to my senior dog. No reaction to my chickens. No reaction to the people or dogs at a petstore. She will get carsick though if the drive is long.

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  • Thats a cute pup for sure. Almost has that great pyrenees look to it.
  • Yep, she does kind of look like a GP. :-) She has a thick puppy coat that's a tad long, and her ears are widely spaced and down which is typical of a Korean breed at this age.
  • She's pretty cool looking! Congrats to your Dad, and I'll be really interested in following her growth and development. Already interesting to me that she's interested in balls and not squeakers..I'm just intrigued in the differences in toy preferences.
  • The first pic you posted, couldn't really see how thick and long her coat was, but the other pics can really see it!

    Would love to learn more about this breed since I never heard of it before. Keeps us updated with her! :]
  • That's really neat. Definitely give updates!
  • Very cute pup! Cant wait to hear more about her and the breed and she grows up
  • She really does look like a GP... Like a GP x Akita. She's super cute! :o)

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  • I concur, SUPER CUTE! Congrats on the new addition. :-)
  • She's adorable!
  • Very cute! :) I have never heard of this breed before, so thank you for sharing.
  • aykayk
    edited June 2011
    Just some new pics of PoongSoon. She's about 12 weeks old and 24 lbs. Her ears went up this week. Instead of a Great Pyrenee, she looks like an Akita in the bright light :-)

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    And this is her right after her first puppy socialization class today. A very tired pup.

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  • So cute! Thanks for giving us an update on her.
  • Omg! What a cutie!!
  • She is very pretty with her ears up. I wonder how big she will be...Thigh-high or bigger?

    What is the PS's primary job in NK? I googled around a bit but couldn't find what the breed was developed for.

    Are you "The Girl with the Gae"?
  • Awwww! Cute!
  • aykayk
    edited June 2011
    @jan3t Yeah, that's my blog.

    Most Koreans will refer to Poongsans as hunting dogs, similar to the Siberian Laikas. In the past, there were a lot of big predators in northern Korea which is now controlled by North Korea. Siberian tigers, Amur leopards, wolves, brown bears, and wild boars. (Well, wild boars weren't so much predators, but they were big and dangerous.)

    The breed name comes from the mountainous area from where they come from. I believe the mountain range from where they hail from are at 6000 ft elevation. This allowed them to be more isolated and they developed into a breed.
  • So many new breeds (to me) on this forum!

    Would you say the Poongsans are a large, courageous guardian with good hunting skills? Do they tend to be of independent or collaborative temperament? They would certainly blend into the snow.
  • wow! She is VERY cute! LOL ... She does look Akita-ish. He coat looks amazing too.

    How did she do at puppy class?

    I didn't know Siberian Tigers were in North Korea. They have a lot more range than I realized.

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  • Hehe, she's so cute! I was going to pitch in "she reminds me of a white malamute", Her coat looks a little like a malamute puppy's as well - though I see the longer hairs on her ears. How long do you think her hair will get? Something like this?

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  • aykayk
    edited June 2011
    @jan3t There's more lore on the breed's hunting prowess rather than guarding ability. Their guarding would be against wild animals that wander into the farm area rather than against people. They're supposed to be really social towards people, much much more than the Jindo.

    I've asked two sets of owners whose dogs originated from China about how much their dogs weigh, and they didn't really say. Just eye-balling them though, I think one female was probably 50 lbs while the males and the other female was probably in the 60-70 lb range. The three dogs had long legs though that made them thigh-high. Kind of like this dog here:

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    A thicker dog would probably top 80 lbs.

    Some other Poongsans that are supposed to be direct from North Korea are 40-60 lbs which makes them like larger Jindos. Here's a picture of an older pair that was sent over by the North Korean president about 10 years ago. They're only knee-high. It kind of makes me sad to see them age so ungracefully.

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    So what I'm trying to say, "large" may not be the best descriptor for a Poongsan. Probably not to someone like Brad who has COs. :-)

    As for collaborative vs. independent temperament, it's hard to say. Supposedly during a hunt, 3 dogs are used, but most likely they are going to be a family group. Supposedly, the Poongsan has a longer fuse towards other dogs than the Jindo, but once set off, they are just as determined in a scrape. For interaction with their owners, I'm not sure about their willingness to please compared to other breeds yet. With PoongSoon, she's still pretty young in the head and so I don't expect too much from her right now.


    @brad1878 Well, we went early to the class and the instructor loomed over her (leaning over a gate) and she did her first submissive urination. She greeted the early people and played with their dogs. He interrupted her playing when she "dominated" another dog (standing over the laying dog and jaw fencing). At first I was skeptical of what he was reading, but fair enough, it's not too much to ask her to adapt her play style if it makes other dogs and other people uncomfortable. When more dogs came in, she started to dislike their play styles (multiple dogs on one) and my feeling is that she started to get over-stimulated and/or pushed past her threshold. She reacted by walking the perimeter and showing more interest in the people rather than the dogs.

    She refused treats the entire time and so the instructor didn't even try to have me do some of the training. Understandable for me, but he also gave up early with an akita pup when the akita pup only wanted to do half a circle of following before losing interest in treats. He blamed the breed which I kind of disagreed with. If food isn't a motivator, find something else. I don't think we're a good fit for this instructor, maybe because I'm too engrained to obedience style training and women trainers, but I tell myself we're going for the indoor socialization.


    @Crispy There are some Poongsans with that kind of coat like the one here:

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    but I think the longer lengths on PoongSoon will be limited to just her head. Time will tell. :-)

  • @ayk - Funny, I am uber-picky about puppy trainers too. Like way more picky about puppy class trainers than OB trainers. So, I feel your pain, it's hard to find the right puppy class.

    With the exception of not taking treats, it sounds like she did well.

    I agree about the Akita thing - not cool. Sounds like laziness hidden behind breed discrimination to me.

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  • Wow, she's pretty! And yeah, I hear you and Brad on the puppy trainers. Super annoying, and it is hard to get a good one. I'd be annoyed about the akita thing too....After all, my Akita was super good in his puppy class....but also the trainer was very good with all the dogs, and if one treat didn't work, she tried another, or a toy, so....
  • I did not know this breed !! She is beautiful !!!
  • Here are some more recent pictures of her at 5 months of age. It looks like she'll be a long-haired Poongsan with longer ear hairs.

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    And here's a picture of her compared against a young male Poongsan that I picked up from a neglect situation. He has the harsh coat but little undercoat as he was hypothyroid.

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  • I really like that photo... Beautiful dogs!
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