Known medical "problems" with Shikoku

I wanted to know all the known medical problems anyone has ever experienced with Shikokus. I am trying to see if it could be used as a model system/precedence for human diseases. Thanks everyone!
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  • Sugoi suffered from severe diarrhea in the beginning, resulting into some serious bowel problems. Doctor had to cut away about 3 cm of her bowel, the day after already she was again up and about, seems they don't really need a lot of time to recuperate.

    Sandra
  • @Sandra, at what age did this occur? Thanks.
  • edited March 2012
    Kurenai had some serious stomach problems as a lil' puppy (and a UTI). She couldn't hold anything down and kept throwing things up. She eventually grew out of it though. And let's not forget the car-sickness.

    Jesse
  • Miyu has been diagnosed with Moderate Hip Displaysia, plus she has extra nails growing on her front paws and rear dewclaws.
  • edited March 2012
    Rome has had an easily upset stomach since he was a pup. He would go through phases of severe diarrhea and weight loss that the vets could never seem to figure out. He's been better recently. He also has slightly suspect knees. Just throwing it out there that Rome does not get carsick.

    I've seen another young male Shikoku with cataracts, and another young Shikoku with 'mystery leg pain' that usually presents after exercise. This mystery leg pain has been described as something wrong with the nervous system by several NIPPO members, and at least one vet, but I'm leaning more toward something in the joints (LP/HD).

    I've also seen and heard of Shikoku with entropion, and at least two with severe spinal deformation.
  • @TheWalrus The leg pain after exercise is what Koda had for several months before his ligament finally blew. Just throwing it out there. It could be ligament disease.
  • @tjbart17 possibly. I guess the difference I've seen so far is that I haven't yet seen a 'blow'. It gets better within a few days, and then comes and goes.
  • The Singers have a predisposition to Pancreatitis. I wonder if it might be possible to have a database of health problems with any of the Shikokus. There is also a huge problem in modern breeds with IBD.
    When I travel with my dogs, I always bring bottled water. Both my Akita and Chinook seem to have iron stomachs, but I give them probiotics.
  • I find this really interesting, since most of the Japanese breeds seem fairly healthy. I was actually drawn away from the Shikoku and towards the Kishu because of the health problems in the Shikoku I'd seen discussed on the forum.

    So, are leg and bowel/digestion problems common in Shikoku, would you say, or is it just that people are more inclined to speak up about it when it happens on the forum? :o

    I do notice that Mura, the Shikoku that I see at work, has a strange way of moving. It doesn't quite remind me of HD dogs, but she seems a bit... "stiff", I guess, in her rear. It could be nothing, but I'm a bit dubious after seeing the discussions on Shikoku hips/leg pains. I know she came in with medication on her first stay for impacted glands(?)/infection, I think. Is this a problem anyone else has seen/is it more prevalent in the Shikoku or is it more of a unlucky strike kind of thing?



    With the Shikoku Preservation coming up, I've been seriously reconsidering my lean towards a Kishu (which appears to be doing fairly well as a breed) in the last month and started leaning back towards the Shikoku as my first choice and I'd like to know a little more about the possible health issues - so I hope more discussion like this happens.
  • edited March 2012
    I've been calling it "Stomach Sensitivity" but it could have something to do with digestion? I've noticed that Shoushuu, Kotomi and Shuran have grown out of the car sickness issue. Though rarely, especially at higher altitudes/elevations, they will relapse with car sickness. Sakura has NEVER gotten car sick while in my care to date. Kotomi and Shuran have in the past randomly thrown up bile. Reason for this is unknown so I suspect it had to do with that "Stomach Sensitivity".


    Shoushuu has an allergy to Chicken.


    I've been told that Shikoku are prone to skin allergies as well.
  • I know there are research studies about IBD. I have an allergic Chinook, shots every 10 days, but no skin sensitivities with the skin except itching if I don't give the shots in spring or summer. It would be interesting to catalog the health problems and find research studies to collaborate with.
    Usually that requires a Genetics and Health Committee to legitimize the research in Universities and scholars' eyes.
    OOPS, I don't own a Shikoku. I'll go back to my rock now! But organizing and cataloging is my forte since I am a photographer:-)
  • Is it difficult to breed Shikokus naturally?
  • It seems to be quite a challenge with breeding them from what owners report here.
  • I don't think, and this could be a "fasle perception" that health issues are that prevalent in the breed, all things considered. [ the limited gene pool, the number of dogs, number of breeders, etc. ] I think if you were to compare them to a breed like the GSD, they are pretty healthy.

    That said, I think one of the bigger issues of all seems to be fertility, as Britain asked about. I mean, even if the breed was perfectly healthy, outside the fertility issues, it's sort of a moot point when you have difficulty creating more of the breed!

    That's just my two cents.

    [ FTR, our shikoku male doesn't have any HEALTH issues, that we know of. But I have not had his hips / knees done yet. He doesn't even have the famous shikoku car-sickness or even the stomach sensitivity / allregies, Thank God, & knock on wood! We've been lucky thus far. Now, temperament "issues"....that's a different story lol ] ~
  • Miko gets car sick but has no food issues outside of being a picky eater. We have always fed her grain free, but she has the most consistent stools of any dog I've had. She had a bone spur in her shoulder when she was about two that through routine of rest and limited exercise resolved itself. She periodically donkey kicks, but every time we have had her knees tested the vet swears up and down they are solid.

    Her only issue would be that she is a button pushing punk ass.
  • "Her only issue would be that she is a button pushing punk ass."
    :)
  • I have a Chinook, another rare breed. I grew up with a "REAL" Chinook in the 40's and 50's, one of the original lines and there has been a long history of AKC ruining rare breeds, I will post links later. A closed stud book is dangerous for ANY breed and now there are 2 factions of Chinooks in UKC and AKC. The AKC stud books will be closed in 5 years.
    I am a vocal idealist and I always give back to the breeder ALL health elbows, hips and another health tests which have been several. Whether pet or show, I think following all progeny is crucial. I had suggested to the Akita Club a a committee member of the genetics and health committee that incentives, money back, something for each health test of any adopter of a litter. This would raise the price per well bred dog with the serious pet owners or otherwise more likely to adhere to a COE.
    They thought I was nuts:-)
  • edited March 2012
    Just a thought I've had for awhile on the carsickness thing, I think it's related to anxiety and not a motion-specific thing. I don't think it's an actual motion sickness thing in all the Shikoku, it's seems like an anxiety reaction. Actually, I've noticed a pretty high degree of anxiety in most of the Shikoku I've owned or met. Sometimes it comes across as "control freak", others as neurotic behavior, and some as skittishness.
  • When I visited Kris, her 2 Shikoku were so calm in the house and when outside, alert and barking. They were ideal specimens of the breed, IMHO. I liked Peggy's too.
    That's one thing about Akitas, all of mine have been calm and laid back until, of course, they see a horse or dog. Fenikkusu has what I call reverse prey drive. When with dogs she is a little tease and outruns anyone but maybe a whippet, but when she's in the car driving past dogs make her a vocal girl shouting at prey. They are not running, but we are in the car. She really sounds nasty:-), but she's a gentle little thing and teases, animal or human.
    Tomorrow I return to NH and even in a week, I miss the dogs.
  • I wondered if anyone in Shikokus have COIs on the Pedigrees or used someone like the link before, for diversity and COI's.
  • edited March 2012
    We have now tools to type your dog’s MHC II genes (DLA typing) so that you
    can follow the diversity of your dogs and lines and use this information
    while planning new breedings. It is useful to have a DLA-profile from your
    breed in differnet countries since the frequency of the alleles in the MHC
    genes may vary a lot between populations. Once the DLA-profile is
    established you could compare your dog's profile for the overall breed' or
    line's profile and take it into account while planning new breedings. The
    aim is to maintain the heterozygosity of the MHC region as much as
    possible in the breeding lines. This should reduce the risk for autoimmune
    or other diseases.

    As a general rule it may be wise to avoid increasing homozygosity in the
    MHC locus containing a large number of important genes. There is a growing
    body of evidence that homozygosity in the MHC locus increases the risk for
    autoimmune disorders. Many of the published studies include rather small
    sample numbers. This has effects on the strength of the risk factors and
    significance levels. Larger studies in future should give more accurate
    risk estimates not available yet. However, it may be wise to choose a
    breeding partner that has different haplotypes to maintain heterozygosity
    and diversity in your litters and lines."
    http://www.genoscoper.com/in_english2/gene_tests/gene_tests/dla_diversity/

    BTW, the MHC was a pilot study in Akitas by Center for Companion Animal Health at UC Davis.
    I think the research may have been done by Dr Mark Neff or Dr Neils Pederson.
  • IMHO having anxiety and being calm have little to do with each other. I'm generally a calm person, but I have some anxiety about certain situation.
  • edited March 2012
    I suppose that's true.
    But then there's high strung, for lack of a better phrase and then there's calm.
  • I'm with Brad on this one. Koda and Mei are suuuuuupppppppeeeerrrr calm in the house, but they both have some anxiety. I think a hunting dog should have some anxiety.
  • You are right that outside and inside are 2 different worlds for hunting dogs.
  • @brada1878 I can definately see the anxiety part. I have noticed a (hopefully not illusory) correlation between Argos's anxiety regarding vehicles and his carsickness. When we first got him as a wee one, he shivered and shook when he was in the vehicle, which was unavoidable transporting him around the lower mainland. He got carsick/was on the verge of sickness quite a lot during that time. He wouldn't take treats, and I think his anxiety about vehicles (and perhaps the sickness perpetuated the anxiety?) extended to being outside of vehicles, as walking through a parking lot or even by vehicles sent him into shakes (we borrowed my friend's rock-solid king sheppard for some modeling behaviours around vehicles, and since then he's been fine walking by them, as no other technique [systematic desensitazation, treating, etc.] worked with him). Through enough car rides, his anxiety levels have gone down (he'll now take treats), and as his anxiety levels have gone down, as has his vomiting/signs of imminent vomiting. He hasn't vomited since his anxiety has gone down, and the prerequisites for vomiting (drooling) have gone down since he's started to willingly hop into the vehicle. The really odd part is on the plane ride home, he vomitted once, despite barely being able to feel the motion (at least to me), but was clearly anxious. Just my observations.

    Regarding the stomach, Argos seems to have a stomach of iron. We can switch between raw and kibble without any problems, between wet foods and treats, and he's fine. Glad for that. :)
  • My 2 shikoku (mentioned above by Britain [thanks!]) have been very healthy.

    My male is 4 1/2 and outside of a single month of car sickness as a puppy, he has been very healthy and also has a stomach like iron like BradnJess mentioned. He had very good hip, elbows, knees on evaluation and has never seemed to have any movement issues, joint isssues, pain of any kind for that matter. He is a very athletic dog.

    My female definitely has car sickness that was anxiety related as Brad and BradnJess mention. She is much better now, but still gets sick on occasion. She rides better in the truck than car. She also is very healthy and has zero signs of pain of any kind. Her knees were rated "normal" and her hips/elbows looked good on exray too (per my vet, waiting on OFA ratings). She also has a stomach of steel and can eat anything, never gets sick from food.
  • I love Sachiko and Kuma. They are the Shikokus of my dreams:-)
  • I think Brad has hit on something here. I can't speak for another Shikoku, but I can speak for Ronan. He's what I call primitively skittish. New things are usually spooky to him. A friend has wolfdogs, and I've noticed the same pacing, circling behavior from them when there's something new around some of them. Seems the more wolf in them, the more primitive her dogs' behavior is. Ronan is like that. No idea why. He's great with people. Not good at ALL with other animals. It's not that he doesn't want to be. He cries, whines, wags his tail, seems interested, but nervous. The trouble starts when the other animal makes ANY eye contact. Ronan explodes. When the other dog turns and walks away, Ronan goes back to crying as if to say, "Hey! I didn't mean it! Come back!" It doesn't matter if Ronan is on leash or separated by a fence.
    New things in the house that make noise or are large? Spooky.
    What's not spooky? Snakes. He's had a run-in with a couple Eastern Banded Kings and he still tries to 'play' with them. My fear is that one day, it'll be a Copperhead. Opossums are fair game, too. He's killed one and made another play dead. The one he killed was huge! And somehow, he escaped the skirmish without a single bite.
    But anxiety is definitely Ronan's problem.
  • Kitsu is definitely skittish. I thought this was well-established with Shikoku, though - that they are very cautious about anything new to them, but willing to investigate it until they can make a more informed decision.

    Of course, there's the car-sickness. I've also wondered if it's anxiety-related. I notice that she tends to throw up when I'm slightly lost or pressed for time driving somewhere, and I've wondered if she's just mirroring my stress.

    Kitsu seems to have really itchy skin when she's blowing out her coat - to the point where she chews herself raw. But aside from that I don't suspect any allergies or skin problems. Overall, she seems to be a very physically healthy dog.

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