So...wait. Do I have this right? You guys are putting choke chains on your dogs to carry his ID tags? You are referring to a chain slip collar, right? and the reason is because it wont ruin his/her fur?
If I misunderstand, then help me know what is really meant.
If I dont misunderstand, then have you weighed the risk that wearing a choke chain while not attached to a leash and actually working carries? They are not for just wearing. I know people do it, (hell, ive seen people with flexi leads attached to choke chains and headcollars...) but these choke collars can get caught on things and choke the dog. (I know a woman who left choke chains on her 2 dogs as their daily wear collars and came home from work to find them entangled and one choked dead- horrible. horrible! and it took years of being 'fine' before it happened, but she'd give ANYTHING to have her dog back.) and does this risk seem worth it? A choke chain collar constricts completely under enough pressure/panic, unlike a limited slip collar, or a flat collar. Plain collars are for ID tags. chain collars are for training (should you choose to use them) and should be taken off when not in the act of training.
I modified the chains so they can't choke. One was turned into a limited slip, by adding another ring to it, so it can only shorten by a couple inches then stops. The other was shortened (since it was too big) and attached to the ring I didn't cut off (sorry that wasn't more clear in the previous post). It's a static size, so it really can't be useful even for walking a dog since their head can just slip right out of it.
Anyways, I personally have no issue with choke collars for ID tags, even if they are not modified. I do know there is a risk but so is there with a regular flat collar (I know a few people who've had dogs die from hanging with a flat collar). I usually don't leave any type of collar on my dogs, though, since they go into the bushes in my backyard and have gotten caught before, and I just prefer them without them on. The girl's flat collars are lose enough to get off when they do wear them, which is what their tags are on. I don't really walk any of my dogs with a collar, but when I do, it's with a martingale that is taken off after every walk. The flat collars I use when I go places and feel they need ID.
Since this is for ID while traveling, the dog is never really out of my sight or far away from me, let alone running loose anywhere. Choking to death while left alone isn't really a possibility.
I share Chrys' concerns. If you're going to leave a choke chain on as a tag collar, at least dead lock it like Losech has (so it doesn't tighten). Dogs can strangle on just about anything, but it's a bigger risk with chokers, especially if they hang really loose.
I've seen dogs get a foot caught in the hanging chain and cripple themselves, and my own who was wearing a LIMITED SLIP chain, hooked his foreleg thru the loop on the limited slip part and as he got tired, the weight of his foreleg tightened the chain and started strangling him. I was maybe 20 feet away the entire time and heard nothing, until I just happened to look up and saw him staggering towards me.
That was one of the most frightening moments with my Shibas for knowing what could have happened, the other was seeing the young one get her tags caught in the top of her crate and choke herself. Thank goodness I was there each time, and now I dont leave tags or collars on when crated (aside from a show chain when crated at a dog show).
It's one of those rare things, but it sure is heart stopping and shocking when it actually happens!
My crate pan has huge letters embossed in it that says "REMOVE COLLAR WHEN IN CRATE" or something like that. I think it's very sound advice. I don't leave the martingales on for the reason Lindsay said above. The chains on them are just too loose, and a dog could easily get a foot or lower jaw stuck in the loop.
@WrylyBrindle Yup you understand correctly. With the exception that they're modified, I posted a few weeks back asking to find out how Losech had done it so that it would be safe. Any collar he wears is loose enough for him to back out, with the exception of the Gentle Leader which is only put on for training walks.
Tsune is getting neutered with my next paycheck and a microchip inserted during the surgery. Until that chip is put in, the combination of a senile grandmother (who has let him "escape" five times) combined with how smart he is (door + grandma = adventure time!) means there is absolutely no way I'm leaving him without identification even if that means minor risk of strangling himself with a collar. I'd rather he get loose, found, and returned instead of loose, found, claimed on a first come, first serve by animal control and most likely get used as a bait fighting dog. That risk outweighs his risk of strangulation.
I know that Losech had the modified collar, which makes sense, but I agree that it is super scary to think of a dog with a choke collar on unattended. And honestly, it's to save the dog's fur? You'd risk strangulation so the fur doesn't get messed up by a regular buckle collar? That absolutely doesn't make any sense to me. It's not an either or--no id or it has to be a choke collar. It can be ID on a buckle collar.
I'd rather have my dog's coat not perfect than I would risk strangulation in a choke collar that wasn't modified. I use the rolled leather collar on my Akita and it doesn't seem to have done much damage to his coat, but even if it did, I wouldn't switch to choke collar when he was unattended.
that's super scary to me.
eta: hmmm...ok, so I guess the collar is modified then so it can't choke? Am I understanding that right? That makes more sense.....
Thanks! I had a vague memory of it, but wasn't sure, and then I just misread your post--I didn't realize you'd done the adjustments to make it a limited slip. Now it all makes sense! Sorry about that!
I will say, though, this discussion made me go and look at everyone's collars again. My dogs wear buckle collars with id (they have nice leather collars, except for the little Leo man, who still has little quick release puppy collar on as we are saving his super cool bark and giggle collar til when he's a bit bigger). But I did think even with the loose collars, what if Bel caught her foot in her collar? She wouldn't choke--it would come off--but she could still be hurt because it is so loose right now (she's been on a diet). So I made some adjustments. I want the collars loose enough that they won't trap the dogs, but if they are so loose a dog could catch a foot in one, or if they come off too easily, then the ID part of it is kind of useless, right?
So the conversation made me check everyone's status!
@shibamistress It's all good. I figured without a picture someone would be going "omg a choke?!" lol Yeah I had Tsune roughhousing with my dad, at one point he was army crawling out from under my bed and got his foot caught up in his collar so that he couldn't get up, he looked at me and went "arooo... " to get my attention and I helped him out, after that it got tightened up enough to be firmly around his neck but still loose enough to slip out if he backed out with some pressure.
Gotta love the diversity in collars here! So many ideas and collars to try out, that's the one conundrum though where if it's too easy to get out then what's the point but if they can't get out it's dangerous. That's what's making me hesitate on getting a Tagg, I don't want him having yet another area of coat thinning (still reconciling skin/coat issues from his "rescuing" 3 months ago, but I want him safe too. Aghh. Might just come down to putting on the Tagg whenever I'm not home or we're expecting visitors.
We should make a "post your collar/harness" thread lol.
It's made by kong & has a chest plate in the front. Figured we try it out, Dragoon fit into a size small. Thus far, and we haven't been able to take her on a long excitable walk yet because of all the rain, but it works great! No more insane choking & wheezing. Let's her pull all she wants without hurting herself
Thought I'd share in case it helped someone else. ~
Mochi has a similar harness. I do the same as someone else mentioned before. I let Mochi pull on a harness if he desires to pull(reminds me of a Husky sometimes lol) and whenever i attach the leash to his collar, it means either training time and/or no pulling time. Works for us
Comments
If I misunderstand, then help me know what is really meant.
If I dont misunderstand, then have you weighed the risk that wearing a choke chain while not attached to a leash and actually working carries? They are not for just wearing. I know people do it, (hell, ive seen people with flexi leads attached to choke chains and headcollars...) but these choke collars can get caught on things and choke the dog. (I know a woman who left choke chains on her 2 dogs as their daily wear collars and came home from work to find them entangled and one choked dead- horrible. horrible! and it took years of being 'fine' before it happened, but she'd give ANYTHING to have her dog back.) and does this risk seem worth it? A choke chain collar constricts completely under enough pressure/panic, unlike a limited slip collar, or a flat collar. Plain collars are for ID tags. chain collars are for training (should you choose to use them) and should be taken off when not in the act of training.
I must misunderstand what you mean...
Anyways, I personally have no issue with choke collars for ID tags, even if they are not modified. I do know there is a risk but so is there with a regular flat collar (I know a few people who've had dogs die from hanging with a flat collar). I usually don't leave any type of collar on my dogs, though, since they go into the bushes in my backyard and have gotten caught before, and I just prefer them without them on. The girl's flat collars are lose enough to get off when they do wear them, which is what their tags are on. I don't really walk any of my dogs with a collar, but when I do, it's with a martingale that is taken off after every walk. The flat collars I use when I go places and feel they need ID.
I've seen dogs get a foot caught in the hanging chain and cripple themselves, and my own who was wearing a LIMITED SLIP chain, hooked his foreleg thru the loop on the limited slip part and as he got tired, the weight of his foreleg tightened the chain and started strangling him. I was maybe 20 feet away the entire time and heard nothing, until I just happened to look up and saw him staggering towards me.
That was one of the most frightening moments with my Shibas for knowing what could have happened, the other was seeing the young one get her tags caught in the top of her crate and choke herself. Thank goodness I was there each time, and now I dont leave tags or collars on when crated (aside from a show chain when crated at a dog show).
It's one of those rare things, but it sure is heart stopping and shocking when it actually happens!
I don't leave the martingales on for the reason Lindsay said above. The chains on them are just too loose, and a dog could easily get a foot or lower jaw stuck in the loop.
Tsune is getting neutered with my next paycheck and a microchip inserted during the surgery. Until that chip is put in, the combination of a senile grandmother (who has let him "escape" five times) combined with how smart he is (door + grandma = adventure time!) means there is absolutely no way I'm leaving him without identification even if that means minor risk of strangling himself with a collar. I'd rather he get loose, found, and returned instead of loose, found, claimed on a first come, first serve by animal control and most likely get used as a bait fighting dog. That risk outweighs his risk of strangulation.
I'd rather have my dog's coat not perfect than I would risk strangulation in a choke collar that wasn't modified. I use the rolled leather collar on my Akita and it doesn't seem to have done much damage to his coat, but even if it did, I wouldn't switch to choke collar when he was unattended.
that's super scary to me.
eta: hmmm...ok, so I guess the collar is modified then so it can't choke? Am I understanding that right? That makes more sense.....
http://www.shibainuforum.org/forum/discussion/9970/who-made-the-modified-choke-collar-so-it-doesn039t-choke#Item_8
Losech basically came up with a way to make it equivalent to a buckle collar without the bulk of a standard buckle collar. I understand your instinctual reaction to the word "choke" but it's no longer a choke collar at this point. It's practically a martingale or alaskan/limited slip.
I will say, though, this discussion made me go and look at everyone's collars again. My dogs wear buckle collars with id (they have nice leather collars, except for the little Leo man, who still has little quick release puppy collar on as we are saving his super cool bark and giggle collar til when he's a bit bigger). But I did think even with the loose collars, what if Bel caught her foot in her collar? She wouldn't choke--it would come off--but she could still be hurt because it is so loose right now (she's been on a diet). So I made some adjustments. I want the collars loose enough that they won't trap the dogs, but if they are so loose a dog could catch a foot in one, or if they come off too easily, then the ID part of it is kind of useless, right?
So the conversation made me check everyone's status!
Gotta love the diversity in collars here! So many ideas and collars to try out, that's the one conundrum though where if it's too easy to get out then what's the point but if they can't get out it's dangerous. That's what's making me hesitate on getting a Tagg, I don't want him having yet another area of coat thinning (still reconciling skin/coat issues from his "rescuing" 3 months ago, but I want him safe too. Aghh. Might just come down to putting on the Tagg whenever I'm not home or we're expecting visitors.
We should make a "post your collar/harness" thread lol.
It's made by kong & has a chest plate in the front. Figured we try it out, Dragoon fit into a size small. Thus far, and we haven't been able to take her on a long excitable walk yet because of all the rain, but it works great! No more insane choking & wheezing. Let's her pull all she wants without hurting herself
Thought I'd share in case it helped someone else. ~