importing question
Hey. We have a lot of threads about importing a japanese akita from japan. (Or korea). Where are these threads??? I cant find them. I seems like there is hardly any search results past a few months back 
If anyone can answer my questions or link me to good sources, thatd be awesome. Most of these questions I have, have been answered, but its been a long long while, like back when toki was just a puppy, before I decided to show him.
Im not saying im going to import....
Basically: WHAT do to know about importing a puppy from Japan?
But these are the questions I was trying to do research on:
-how does one overcome cultural and language barriers in japan?
Should I get a translator?
Who are the key people to talk to who speak english and have good connections with mainstream and underground but good quality breeders? (I love a certain breeder's line, but the US akita population is too saturated with his/her dogs)
Importing is gambling, it seems. I know of a lot of unhealthy imported dogs but a lot of healthy ones, too. Does anyone have any advice on getting a healthy dog from a country thats difficult to visit and doesnt do health checks?
How much would the total cost be? Everything!
What is the cheapest route to getting an import, flying myself with carry on luggage as puppy, flying puppy as cargo, using someone elss to bring dog over. (I pretty much know the answer, but I ask anyway)
Whats the bad and good airlines to avoid/use?
How much do puppies cost in japan compared to the states?
How want the BEST puppy. If im importing, I want pick of litter, or something comprable. I dont want to get slighted. How do I avoid this?
What kind of paperwork do I need/need to fill out at the airport to fly a dog as cargo or carry on?
Hmmmm.....thats all I can think of. Just saying.... im just wondering
Julia
If anyone can answer my questions or link me to good sources, thatd be awesome. Most of these questions I have, have been answered, but its been a long long while, like back when toki was just a puppy, before I decided to show him.
Im not saying im going to import....
Basically: WHAT do to know about importing a puppy from Japan?
But these are the questions I was trying to do research on:
-how does one overcome cultural and language barriers in japan?
Should I get a translator?
Who are the key people to talk to who speak english and have good connections with mainstream and underground but good quality breeders? (I love a certain breeder's line, but the US akita population is too saturated with his/her dogs)
Importing is gambling, it seems. I know of a lot of unhealthy imported dogs but a lot of healthy ones, too. Does anyone have any advice on getting a healthy dog from a country thats difficult to visit and doesnt do health checks?
How much would the total cost be? Everything!
What is the cheapest route to getting an import, flying myself with carry on luggage as puppy, flying puppy as cargo, using someone elss to bring dog over. (I pretty much know the answer, but I ask anyway)
Whats the bad and good airlines to avoid/use?
How much do puppies cost in japan compared to the states?
How want the BEST puppy. If im importing, I want pick of litter, or something comprable. I dont want to get slighted. How do I avoid this?
What kind of paperwork do I need/need to fill out at the airport to fly a dog as cargo or carry on?
Hmmmm.....thats all I can think of. Just saying.... im just wondering
Julia
Comments
http://www.nihonken.org/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/5541/exporting-dogs-from-japan#Item_18
Yes. Preferably the translator should actually be Japanese (or deal with the Japanese a lot) not only to speak the language but to understand bargaining and negotiating with them. The Japanese have some peculiarities when it comes to business arrangements. For example, they don't like to tell a person "No" because it would embarrass that person and cause them to lose face. Instead they may redirect or change the topic to imply "No" without actually saying it, and a non-native may not pick up on the hint. A lot can be lost in translation not just literally but through cultural subtleties as well. It could be frustrating to the Japanese or worse, insulting, if handled incorrectly.
Some breeders who regularly sell internationally can write a little English or have a friend or family member to translate for them. It can be a burden to the breeder and cause a lot of delay relying on these translations.
Attempting to haggle without knowing the culture is more likely to make enemies than get you a good price. So if you don't have a good translator who is looking out for your interests, either take the price the breeder offers or find a different puppy. The same is true when it comes to asking for health clearances. Most find it insulting that you doubt the health and quality of their dogs. Tread carefully even with a translator.
Who are the key people to talk to who speak English and have good connections with mainstream and underground but good quality breeders?
I cannot praise Darvish Shin enough for his help finding Bijo. He spent weeks calling breeders and owners for me, sending me photos of potential dogs, doing more research when I was interested in one in particular. I gave him a set maximum price which I said must also include all of the extras (vet check, microchip, crate, transport to airport, etc). He negotiated with Bijo's owner to meet my price, including a few extra things which happened along the way and by all rights should have cost more. Darvish was honest with me in his evaluations of the potential prospects, letting me know what good and bad traits he saw in each dog. It was invaluable to have a translator who knows the breed very well.
Does anyone have any advice on getting a healthy dog from a country that's difficult to visit and doesn't do health checks?
Find dogs you like that are healthy and purchase from the same line. Find a breeder who is trustworthy and honorable, who will "make things right" if it turns out your dog has problems. Find a kennel that other people you know have visited in person and is close to the Western standard of care.
(NB: The breeder you're thinking of fails at all three aspects above. Imported dogs have had genetic problems, the breeder doesn't make things right when they do, and the kennel conditions are horrible.)
How much would the total cost be?
A show quality Japanese Akita puppy should be 100,000 to 400,000 JPY with average price around 275,000 JPY. Depending on the breeder, the price may include the extras (vet check, microchip, crate, transport to airport, etc) or the extras may be 25,000 to 75,000 JPY additional. Finally, to send a puppy by cargo to LAX you can expect to pay 100,000 to 150,000 JPY depending on the age, weight, and jet fuel prices. It is more economical to fly round trip to/from Japan with the dog as excess baggage, which you should be able to do for about $1,100 USD. Additional airfare from LAX to Dallas will apply of course.
So grand totals... (assuming 100 JPY = $1.08 USD as it is today. When I imported it was $1.31 -- ouch!)
Cheap puppy with extras included and traveling as baggage: $2,175
Cheap puppy with extras included and traveling as cargo: $2,150 to $2,700
Cheap puppy without extras included and traveling as baggage: $2,450 to $3,000
Cheap puppy without extras included and traveling as cargo: $2,425 to $3,500
Average puppy with extras included and traveling as baggage: $4,075
Average puppy with extras included and traveling as cargo: $4,050 to $4,600
Average puppy without included extras and traveling as baggage: $4,350 to $4,875
Average puppy without included extras and traveling as cargo: $4,325 to $5,400
Expensive puppy with extras included and traveling as baggage: $5,425
Expensive puppy with extras included and traveling as cargo: $5,400 to $5,950
Expensive puppy without included extras and traveling as baggage: $5,700 to $6,225
Expensive puppy without included extras and traveling as cargo: $5,675 to $6,750
Note that when I say cheap, you get what you pay for. I have not seen good quality puppies priced that low. Its possible that you may find one if you had an insider living in Japan that is really good friends with a relatively unknown breeder. The corollary is not true; just because a puppy is expensive does not mean its exceptional quality. Buyer beware!
Since you're coming from Dallas not LAX you'll have to consider how to get the pup back to Texas. If round trip between DFW and LAX is necessary (eg. you are going to LAX to pick up the pup or someone is coming from LAX to give the pup to you and then go back home) the cheapest option is to drive. If only one-way travel from LAX to DFW is necessary (eg. the pup has a connecting flight) the cheapest option is to fly.
How much do puppies cost in japan compared to the states?
The price ranges for puppies from reputable JACA breeders are $1,500 to $2,200 for show quality (average $1,800) $800 to $1,500 for pet quality (average $1,200) and $300 to $800 for long coat (average unknown). What extras it includes varies - usually at a minimum shots and deworming. Obviously, shipping and other stuff would vary dramatically depending on your needs and situation.
As you can see, they cost significantly more -- even the "cheap" ones.
I want pick of litter.
That's not going to happen. The Japanese don't send their best dogs overseas. They rarely sell them at all, even within country. When they do they command ridiculous prices ($19,000 for an 8 month old pup comes to mind...).
What will happen is that you will receive an offer on one or maybe two puppies that the breeder thinks you might be interested in. You can either accept the offer or look for something else. Sometimes these will be the puppies left over (10 to 12 weeks old) after the breeder has already made his picks, given the "puppy back" to the stud owner or other breeder friends, etc. Sometimes they will be younger than that, but I caution against deciding at too young of an age. If you want great quality, wait until they're a little older! I've seen some people pick as young as 3 weeks, and maybe that works if you're super experienced, but lets face it -- how many puppies have you graded and watched grow up to see how they turned out? How good is your eye for quality in adult dogs, let alone barely-weaned puppies? Find an experienced breeder you trust, who will not overcharge you or sell you lower quality than you asked for, and let them guide you.
Honestly I don't believe in giving anyone "pick of the litter" either. I think its bad for the dog. I match my puppies to the homes that fit them. If I don't have a puppy that will do well with someone's lifestyle, I tell them that. My responsibility is to the dog, not to making some buyer happy. I am honest and thorough in my evaluations of each pup, so if the buyer isn't interested in what I have to offer, then so be it. I'm not going to sell them something they don't want.
Whats the bad and good airlines to avoid/use?
Stay away from United (UA)! Be wary of other Star Alliance airlines they may follow the same policies as united. Also keep an eye out for airlines which are operated by United, such as All Nippon Airways (ANA).
I highly recommend American (AA) and Japan Airlines (JAL). Most breeders in Japan send their puppies by way of JAL Cargo anyway. Japan Airlines is operated by American and share the same flights.
Note that if the puppy is sent cargo, the choice of airline wont be up to you. You could insist on buying the puppy's waybill yourself if you wanted, but the price to buy the ticket out of country using USD is almost double! Its also really difficult to arrange with the language barrier, time zone differences, necessary flight info for the puppy, etc. So let the breeder handle it.
What kind of paperwork do I need/need to fill out at the airport to fly a dog as cargo or carry on?
For travel as baggage in country, see this website: http://www.flypets.com/. For travel from Japan, the breeder will handle all of the paperwork and air waybill regardless whether the dog is cargo or baggage. If the dog comes from Japan as baggage you don't have to deal with customs. Yay! However, if it is sent as cargo, here's what you need to know:
After the plane lands and has been offloaded the cargo carrier will give you a bunch of paperwork to take to customs. Ask for an area map to get to it. At customs, don't volunteer any information they don't ask for. Say that the dog is for pet and the value is under $1,500. If possible find out what value the breeder declared on the shipping paperwork (make sure it doesn't exceed $2,000) and use the same number. If you say something different they may suspect the dog is not a pet and force you to get a broker.
If the customs person decides you do need to get a broker, s/he will give you a packet of about 500 brokers and refuse to recommend any of them (even to say which ones handle animals). You'll have to call around to find someone open, available on short notice, and able to help with your pup. Go to the broker, give him the power of attorney, sign some paperwork, and wait while he takes it all back to customs. It cost me about an extra $200 with the broker, plus I gave him a huge tip for "rescuing" my puppy before closing time on Easter weekend.
Once customs is dealt with one way or another, take all your papers and stamped forms back to the cargo facility and they'll give you the pup. You don't need to bring anything else with you to pick up the dog just ID and money.
Pups who are under age to receive the rabies vaccination have to be quarantined. This can be done at the new home for 30 days.
So. I should probably clarify it was meant as a general statement
Since there isnt many health checks done overseas, of which, claire brushed upon already. Her answer was what I was getting at
This does not apply to the 2 ladies I am helping get dogs now, they have been great.
Don't forget to budget for currency exchange and wire transfer fees! The banks will hit you in your pocketbook coming and going.
First of all, the wire transfer fee. You should use a service that does a flat fee (typically around $30-$50) instead of a percentage. You will be hemorrhaging money if you pay a percentage.
Secondly, currency exchange. Some banks will exchange the money into yen for a percentage fee. Others will only wire money in USD and the breeder loses part of his payment in the exchange. You do not want that to happen; you will then have to wire more money to cover the difference, which itself will have exchange and transfer fees. Its such a pain.
Instead, find a bank that will send the money as yen. Some do it for "free" but I have found that even the free ones charge you underhandedly. The exchange is supposedly free, but they hide the fee in the exchange rate. For example, with the exchange rate at currently 100 JPY equals $1.08 my bank charges me $1.12 for 100 JPY instead.
Wire transfer fees at $50 a pop are the reason why its best to send all the money at once if you can. On the other hand, if you think that exchange rates will improve before your dog is ready to be shipped, many breeders take a 30% deposit to reserve the dog and must pay the rest before sending the puppy. So you can pay in installments if you will save money in the long run doing it that way.
Ditto what Claire said ^.
For example I would not look at getting a Kozaki dog because the head and build don't meet up well with Toki. (My Opinion) However if I had a dog that had a similar head to Kozaki dogs, I would look to them to compliment what I have.
That is the big complaint that I have with my own breedings. Kayoko is so different to Sachiko. I would prefer a little more consistency. Part of that is from outcrossing but part is not really knowing the type that I want.
I also recommend crunching the numbers on going to Japan and shipping from Japan. I strongly agree with the translator idea. I think it goes a long way.
Oh and for the love go GOD do not haggle.
....warning: long stream of thought paragraph....
The flip side of the coin, (one of my main concerns) is that I have to figure out if starting a breeding program is something I want to do now or later presumably with an import as a foundation female. ("now" being within the foreseeable next few years, "later" being a few years+ away). My gut tells me later, but by the time i'm done with college, the female will be grown and ready to breed. But then, what if I'm planning on buying a house or something after college; i will want to have a cash reserve for the breeding in case i have to refund people back puppies or something goes terribly wrong. Plus, i don't really like jumping in heads first into a major thing like breeding, (i want to be a book expert on everything before actually doing it), so co-owning would be a good way to get my feet wet and learn about the process before starting up my own program, and since I am back in college, I have some time to kill. I have this co-owning opportunity, and it is something that doesn't come by often, especially from kennel I highly respect, so part of me wants to jump on it. The other part of me is like, eff it, lets import. It would be good for the genetic pool in the states. But at the moment, I'm leaning towards importing after I finish college in a few years, maybe for a 3rd dog. But then, 3 dogs is the max i ever want to have, (unless i had a big house and big yard, i could maybe do 4), how would I expand on a breeding program if I ever want it to move forward. I'm just trying to weigh my options and figure out the most responsible way to do this. I dunno. Its not a fully developed thought process, as you can see. See my turmoil in my head? haha
...end of long stream of thought paragraph
Frankly, the first reason I am getting a female is so that Toki can have a buddy he is compatible with. They're family, afterall. And I think that is given with everyone's dogs here. That is the bottom line.
Though, of course, there is the second reason I getting a female, which I think is pretty obvious!
To import from Korea. its always better to have someone bring them.
you can just get health certificate if pup is not older than 3 months old.
you can get rabbie shot and wait 1 month if pup is older than 3 months. so pup will be 4 months old.
Last time when 1 of my friend bought dog from korea, we paid 250 for shipping and 250extra for favor. I do have alot of friend traveling to korea but hard to find someone who will bring dog for free. lol but still much cheaper than cargo and safer.
dogs in korea that I get is between 1500-3000 depends on quality. bit higher than other korean breeder but he is only breeder that I trust and quality is amazing.
Best part for me to import dog from this guys is, i know he will give me best quality pup to me even though i'm in USA. And my mistake was I thought I can do same thing with Kozaki and didn't really be picky with him.
Let me explain my experience with Geen from Korea.
I didn't really know him when I got Karin from Korea.
I paid full amount after he had litter to get pick of litter male.
He had 9 pups including 3 long hair. He chosen the best male pup for me and sent me the pic. I was really happy with quality. Big bone, good color, marking, great akita face.
and Geen found out that he had problem with his teeth at 3 months of age.
he called me and offered the female that he wanted to keep for his breeding plan.
he didn't really like the other males. good ones are already sold.
That is how I got my Karin and I'm really happy with her.
I think it is better to import 8-12 months pup from Japan instead of importing 2-3 months old pups. I know that it is really important to socialize your pup at young age but if you want qulity dog.
I'm planning on 3rd one from Korea. i guess It's better gamble for me to get it from my friend instead of japanes breeder.
And I totally understand your reasoning for posting your statements, it is a public forum available to thousands of people, afterall.
This is just my opinion based on what I saw at the show, but I'd like to see Toki matched to a dog that has stronger rear leg angulation. The Shirai imports have okay angulation, but too many of their 100% offsprings have weak rear legs. I'd skip Toki x Shirai line.
I did really like Ben's new Yamaguchi female, and he showed me a picture of a really nice black brindle in Japan that he's eyeing from Yamaguchi. Good structure and height.
I also really like the pictures I see of Geen's exported dogs on Facebook, too. I'm happy to hear that more of his will be coming to the U.S. via Tae.
Would it be fair to say that females take a bit longer to grow into their look than males?
There are few females that I can look at and say WOW, one of them is Sara Go Shirai. She's got amazing bone structure and has just got an "air" about her
@timkim, Karin is my favourite female brindle in North America, I'm really excited to see her mature and become a mom.
@ayk, if it wasn't for my contact, I wouldn't have a dog right now. Good contacts are everything, especially in Japan.
@jellyfish, i'm glad you've decided to consider breeding Toki even though you intended for him just to be a pet. He has turned out to be quite a beautiful dog and I'm optimistic that you'll find him a bff that could turn out to be his mate if they're well matched. My Saigo will be a pet too, that's his original purpose, :P, but if he turns out to be hotstuff (I've been told by many seasoned breeders that his pedigree is really good, and that Shirai-san is having a hard time letting him go...lol ) then I'll feel bad not studding him out. I really would like to do the most I can to preserve and enhance the breed. :x There is a dude here in Ottawa, Canada who might be starting up a AKIHO kennel, i'm excited and hope he does. I heard he was thinking of importing a Yamaguchi female.
@mapletwinkie, bahaha, I disagree, I think that it takes longer for males to grow into their adult selves than females. Though, I think when it comes down to it, it depends on the bloodlines and genetics of the individual dog rather than it just being simply "male" and "female". I feel like Toki's sister, Zuma, grew evenly and didn't go through a lanky phase like how Toki did/is, and I've always contributed that to Toki being much taller than Zuma and having more varied genetics due to outcrossing.
And thanks! I'm glad I have too. Its not a secret that I don't mind using him as a stud dog, so I don't mind talking about it publicly. The only way I feel comfortable breeding Toki is if someone comes to me asking for him, AND that person tells me something along the lines of, "your dog has these good qualities where mine fails and I want to improve my lines with your dog", or something legit like that. Of course, that may never happen, it isn't a big deal, but I'm leaving the option open for preservation/enhancing purposes. But hey, the Toklaton is badass, and who doesn't want badass pups