Nihon Ken and SSA ( & breed match ? )
Hi there.
I am looking to add a pup within the next year. I've been looking into Kai and Akitas mostly.
My problem is that I get really worried about same sex aggression. I have a male dog, and would like to also add a male dog. Now, in other breeds like the GSD, same sex aggression is usually genetic, it is prevalent in certain lines.
I've contacted a few Akita breeders and they act like I'm crazy. Like Akitas can ONLY exist in opposite sex pairs. I understand that a lot of them don't want to say "Told you so" or possibly have to take the pup back when it crops up as they mature.
A lot of you have multiple dog homes, how do your Nihon Ken do with your dogs (and others?)
Also, just throwing this out here to see if anyone can give me their expert opinion on if I should have a NK..
I am looking for an athletic dog. Doesn't have to be Border Collie crazy or anything, but a dog that likes being out a lot. At the same time, one who can completely relax at home and isn't always looking for something to do. A dog that isn't offended easily, and recovers well. Friendliness is wonderful, being aloof doesn't bother me one bit, he doesn't have to love other dogs or people but should be able to ignore them (with training), but fear or aggression towards dogs / people is a no-no.
I have a 3 year old male Husky / GSD mix, and go hiking with my friend's dogs a lot, as well as encountering many dogs and people on trails, which is why I find it really important that my new pup can join in without any quarrels.
I also intend to add another dog down the line, so that I have 3 in my pack, while fostering dogs occasionally.
Thank you. C:
I am looking to add a pup within the next year. I've been looking into Kai and Akitas mostly.
My problem is that I get really worried about same sex aggression. I have a male dog, and would like to also add a male dog. Now, in other breeds like the GSD, same sex aggression is usually genetic, it is prevalent in certain lines.
I've contacted a few Akita breeders and they act like I'm crazy. Like Akitas can ONLY exist in opposite sex pairs. I understand that a lot of them don't want to say "Told you so" or possibly have to take the pup back when it crops up as they mature.
A lot of you have multiple dog homes, how do your Nihon Ken do with your dogs (and others?)
Also, just throwing this out here to see if anyone can give me their expert opinion on if I should have a NK..
I am looking for an athletic dog. Doesn't have to be Border Collie crazy or anything, but a dog that likes being out a lot. At the same time, one who can completely relax at home and isn't always looking for something to do. A dog that isn't offended easily, and recovers well. Friendliness is wonderful, being aloof doesn't bother me one bit, he doesn't have to love other dogs or people but should be able to ignore them (with training), but fear or aggression towards dogs / people is a no-no.
I have a 3 year old male Husky / GSD mix, and go hiking with my friend's dogs a lot, as well as encountering many dogs and people on trails, which is why I find it really important that my new pup can join in without any quarrels.
I also intend to add another dog down the line, so that I have 3 in my pack, while fostering dogs occasionally.
Thank you. C:
Comments
At present there are 10 Akitas in my house. Four are mature adults, one is a juvenile, and five are seven-week-old puppies. One adult is male, two puppies are male; the rest female. One adult is spayed; the rest intact. The puppies have their own room, but all of the others -- including momma -- sleep in our bedroom at night just inches apart from each other. They eat separately but within line of sight of one another in their kennels. They run and play loose together in the backyard, although not if we're out of the house and of course not when a bitch is in heat. Additionally, all of my older dogs have visited polite, spayed dogs belonging to my friends at haphazard intervals for socialization and play nicely with them at every visit.
Right now my situation is pretty good, but I've had a taste of the bad times. When Gryphon and Gojira came into heat at the same time for the first time since Gojira was full grown, Gryphon started acting really testy with Gojira. Gojira had just started going through the "hardening" phase of early adulthood; she was no longer a happy easygoing puppy who likes everyone, and she didn't appreciate Gryphon's surly attitude. Both being in heat just made matters worse. They had fights. Nothing bad enough to go to the hospital, but it really stressed us out. They had to be kept separate all the time and would growl at each other through the sliding glass door. Gojira even leaned how to push the door open if it was unlocked, and charged into the house to attack Gryphon once. Since then we always keep it locked, and if there's any issue at doorways we walk around the house to go into the backyard. One fight occurring literally between my husband's legs as he was trying to take Gryphon her dinner was enough.
But it didn't stop when the girls came out of heat... and then Gryphon started acting really sick. We took her to the vet, who diagnosed her with closed pyometra. She had an emergency spay to save her life, but had to stay quiet while she recovered from surgery. The dogs remained separate during this time which further increased excitement and reactivity at doorways. It was months after Gryphon's recovery when they got along again. We realized that total isolation was contributing to the issues, and that seeing each other and sleeping next to each other (in crates) every day helped desensitize them, mend wounds, and bury hatchets.
Still... any time that something exciting happened, there was a chance that Gojira would redirect onto Gryphon. Never anything serious, we called these spats "arguing with teeth." We would break them up and once calmed down acted as though everything was normal. Even these arguments which were loud and scary but harmless were stressful to my husband. He worried constantly about the dogs fighting, and had a tendency to project his stress into the situation... often making it worse. Such things as tensing up and jerking on one of the dog's collars when the other dog walked by.
In time we learned the best tactic is to distract the dogs and diffuse the situation with something positive but not too exciting they can focus on instead of each other. Now we don't ever need to put this knowledge to use, but I definitely feel more capable of handling fights than before. That said, NONE of these incidents were they actively trying to injure one another. There have been punctures and scrapes, even a couple that bled profusely, but these occurred by chance during the argument. Neither dog has gone for the throat or vital organs, nor bit down and tore flesh on purpose.
I was stressed enough with the arguments... and would not want to live with dogs who were more intent on harming each other. The daily management of making sure they never, ever, ever get loose with one another is a nightmare. Knowing that a dog's life is on the line if you fuck up is even worse.
All my ladies sleep in their own kennels, but could sleep together. They eat in their kennels as well because I have one that is food aggressive. That was probably my fault, though. I let her eat with 3 cats when she was a puppy and one of the cats was feral. I was young and very stupid when I got her.
My parents also have 2 male chihuahuas. That's a breed known for being grouchy. They don't have any problem with the boys and when my chi visits, no problems. They treat her the same as they treat each other, which is very sweet and snuggly.
Maybe I got lucky with mine, but that is my personal experience. @poeticdragon has more experience and is a better person to ask, but I wanted to chip in my two cents that it can be done and with different breeds.
If you do decide to have an Akita or any breed known for same-gender issues, I definitely recommend both animals be spayed/neutered. It will make your life so much easier. Both Gryphon and Gojira (who was spayed later) mellowed out noticably afterwards.
I don't know much about akitas (and if you are looking at AA or JA makes a difference as well) but Kais are awesome dogs, high energy, high prey drive outside. Mine is fairly passive inside, she would rather be outside but she can become highly destructive if allowed to get bored. She will never just stare at you for hours on BC style watching your every move, but she will at somepoint come to you and encourage you to do something with her.
I think this gives a fairly good, brief, overview: http://www.shibainuforum.org/forum/discussion/3169/are-you-thinking-about-getting-a-nihon-ken/p1
You'll be fine.
My AA is quite happy living with a female Shiba (now gone) and a male Kai Ken, though he doesn't get along with the male Shiba. It's individual dogs. All his dog friends have been other neutered males, too (mostly simply because more people I know have male dogs than females).
And I still hear it all the time--you have to have male/female pairs, blah blah blah. I haven't believed it since my female Shiba nearly killed my male Shiba.
I think there's a confirmation bias with people who believe in same-sex aggression. Every time they hear of two female or to male dogs fighting, they attribute it to same-sex aggression. Every time they hear about opposite-sex dogs fighting, they just dismiss it as being attributed to some other factor.
Intact dogs are a different matter. It's doable, you just have to be mindful. Bitches go into heat and act different (and so do the dogs around them), no doubt about it. Although most pet owners neuter their animals, so it shouldn't be an issue.
Sometimes I wonder if stuff like this is an excuse for producing an aggressive animal. "Well, OF COURSE that dog became aggressive, everyone knows akitas can't be kept in same-sex pairs." Again, this is confirmation bias, probably accompanied with an inability or unwillingness to see the real issues. I think you're producing dogs that honestly can't live with other dogs of the same sex under any circumstance, then you're doing it wrong. It's not like it's in the breed standard.
All the girls are fine with the girls, and all the boys are fine with the boys, and they are all fine with each other. We also have 3 females in heat right now, so the boys are a little extra "amped". No issues.
Now, if I were to let Jingu out with the Kai boys and Taskin - it would go bad. Or if I let Kishin out right now with the Nio and Kona (he's fine with Akashi), that too would go bad. They're all males - one could claim that's the reason why they don't get along with the others... but how would one explain the other 6 males who are fine with one another?
Then there is Ike (intact male WSL), who would do ok with Jingu and Taskin but not Kishin or the Kai boys - Ike treats Luytiy like a bear and tries to tree him, so they're never together either.
It's all about the individual dog. Kishin is a bully and likes to play too hard for the Kai and Taskin - which tips into a disagreement, while Jingu is afraid of Taskin and so acts defensive with him - which causes Taskin to slip into "fight mode".
So yeah, all about the individual dogs!
That said, I have noticed he seems to love female dogs. It's not that he dislikes males or anything, but his favorite playmates tend to be females. That said, that could also just be that it tends to be that people I know who have dogs have female dogs and Zim seems to attach most to dogs he has individual playdates with.
@omgtain..........what ever breed you want to add to your home, and what ever the opinions of the members may be, you will never know the things you have asked in your post. Some dogs get a long fine, others don t. Every dog is different, male or female, GSD or Shiba. You can pick a pup, but you will never know that the dog will show agression towards humans or other dogs. If you socialize the dog properly, it can help. But there always will be a moment that dogs in the same house will try to see who is in charge....female or male, GSD or whatever breed.......a friend of mine has 3 female dogs, they get a long fine.......they surely had their arguments in the past....
and sometimes 2 males constanly attack each other to see who is the boss, a fight can start with no reason at all.....like I said earlier, no dog is the same..... it has nothing to do with a specific breed JMO