Many animal rescue groups, pounds, shelters and humane societies will continue to be exempt from APHIS regulations. Also exempt are the following: people who breed and sell working dogs; people selling rabbits for food, fiber (including fur) or for the preservation of bloodlines; children who raise rabbits as part of a 4-H project; operations that raise, buy and sell farm animals for food or fiber (including fur); and businesses that deal only with fish, reptiles and other cold-blooded animals.
I have not read the official 91 page document yet.
Thanks @sjp051993. Ah I see @ayk...that's interesting. So that means all dogs for the preservation effort you own have to be breeding dogs?? You can't keep any as pets? You can only breed them for so long though, so that doesn't 100% make sense to me..
I need to actually sit down and read the whole document before I ask anymore questions. I apologize if my questions are silly.
@sjp051993 that sentence part is about rabbits being sold for the preservation of bloodlines.
However, the big document does say that breeding dogs are exempt, along with hunting, security, and "other purpose" working dogs. It clarifies that breeding, hunting, and security dogs are merely examples of purposes for a dog. Guide dogs and other service animals are also exempt; indeed, any purpose which is not one of the main six gets a free pass.
That said, if you sell ANY dog for one of the six purposes which are not exempt (research, teaching, testing, experimentation, exhibition, or pet) you lose the exemption. A dog which is sold for multiple purposes, and one of those purposes is one of those six things, will also cause you to lose the exemption.
In short, if you wish to claim preservation of rare bloodlines, ALL puppies you sell must be sold for breeding and must NOT be pets or show dogs. (Yes, it makes no sense.)
Holy. Shizballs. You have to be kidding me.. Thanks for clarifying @poeticdragon
ETA: So basically this sounds to me like if you wanted to preserve a breed, it would be easier to have several people in touch collaborating in breeding efforts (each with less than 4 "breeding females") than having one person trying to make it work with many breeding females..Uy yuy. This is going to get interesting, isn't it...
FYI this regulation is not retroactive. If breeders with more than four intact females stop using "pet quality" and "show quality" to define their puppies and come up with some purpose that all or most of the dogs they produce in the future can be trained to do (including breeding) and advertise their puppies for that purpose... they should be covered.
My primary concern is that we cannot sell retired show/breeding dogs or imports that didn't work out for our breeding program, regardless of the number of females owned.
Brad has hit at the heart of what we need to do, it going to take cooperation to bridge the gene pool issue.
We kinda had an idea this was coming down the pike last year but talk about stinkin it up with convoluted messy info ….. bit of an assumption on cost and effort too. Until there is detailed compliance info it is going to be speculation as far as answers to many of our questions.
Here is a link to the flow chart from the past (change in limit to 4 intact females).
In being well informed, what I am trying to figure out where the "risk base inspection system" they speak of is outlined that calculates the risk levels for a kennel? In addition, where is the "facility compliance standard" documentation listed for AWA? I am not familiar with the APHIS process so maybe I missed it, but I don't see regulation standards for "wholesalers" or reference to where those regs can be found for those that have more than four breeding bitches. If someone has a link to any of the aforementioned please post it.
I think there's a bit too much weight being placed into this. There's nothing stopping anyone from doing private face-to-face dealings, and they certainly won't have the resources/funding to police and entire country's worth of breeders. Just make people sign contracts with a clause saying that they are not for show/only for preservation, and you are CYA'ing yourself just fine. Once the dog is out of your hands then your responsibility ends there, and what the new owner does with the pet is their own business. Just make the paperwork reflect the rules, and anything extra is a non-issue. That's all they care about to be honest.
@Crispy No, there are no specific exemptions for 501c3 or rescues. There are comments about why they chose not to do so, mainly that even rescues can get overwhelmed and have poor living conditions. Therefor they must be subjected to the same public oversight. I know of a number of incidents of a "rescue" actually being a hoarder in disguise...
@*JackBurton* Right. Any animal which was not born and raised on your premises must be sold face-to-face to remain exempt. The four female rule does not apply. Here is the entire section explained:
Breeding Females and Offspring: “And who sells only the offspring of these dogs, cats, or small exotic or wild mammals, which were born and raised on his or her premises….”
[...]
Several commenters stated that breeders often sell a breeding female to individuals who are aspiring breeders or who wish to add new bloodlines to their breeding program; one commenter stated that the occasional addition of such bloodlines is necessary in order to preserve genetic diversity in his breed. Other commenters stated that they occasionally sold "retired" breeding females to friends or acquaintances as pets. A number of commenters suggested that we amend the paragraph so that both the breeding females and their offspring may be sold.
We are not amending the paragraph in the manner suggested by the commenter. The paragraph pertains to a distinct category of breeders that APHIS has evaluated and determined to be low risk for noncompliance with the AWA. The amendments requested by the commenters would expand the paragraph’s scope to include breeders that APHIS has not evaluated.
We note, however, that the commenters who stated that they sold breeding females as pets did not specify where the breeding females were born and raised. The exemption allowance on the number of breeding females only applies when dogs are sold that are born and raised on the seller’s premises. If the breeding females were not born and raised on the premises, the seller does not qualify for this exemption regardless of the number of breeding females they maintain, but may still be exempt from licensing as a retail pet store depending on the manner in which they sell the animals (i.e., face-to-face). Breeders who sell breeding females for purposes other than the six uses listed in the definition of dealer may also be exempt under this rule.
EDIT: I am going to make a "Do I need a license?" flow chart later
@ cezieg, for those with few dogs it is simpler. For those who have more than four intact females they will need more info on guideline to meet compliance and answer the many questions people have.
@cezeig That was basically the point of my above post. Breeders with more than 4 intact females can just stop using "pet quality" or "show quality" entirely. However, they must also advertise and promote their dogs for sale for some specific purpose other than pet or exhibition. It is alright if some puppies are not suitable for that purpose and end up as pets, but the seller must show that the intent was there.
Static you hit the nail on the head co-op is the ideal way to go.
I've been moving away from pet show for a couple litters now. I get plenty of pet apps so I'm just going to have people come get them and the long coats. The shows which "meet the standard" are the only shipped pups. I'll still keep with my policy of paying for the owners Akiho and JACA membership as this promotes the preservation angle. Besides ill only have two intact females.
One thing that I won't get involved in is importing pups for others.
@ cezieg, for those with few dogs it is simpler. For those who have more than four intact females they will need more info on guideline to meet compliance and answer the many questions people have.
Snf
Absolutely. I meant moreso along the actual sale aspect of it. It sounds like preservation breeding is protected nicely, and it's the sale methods that are the most critical aspect. So it's primarily a legal issue of covering oneself.
It's all very similar to the sale of firearms. There really isn't any enforceable regulation outside of vendor and mail order sales. For a similar situation, I could sell all the moonshine I want face to face, it's when it goes through the mail or taxable channels that it becomes an issue.
Also, keep in mind that emails count as legal communication documents that can be utilized in court for any reason. Just a helpful tidbit.
The term "intermediate handler" means any person including a department, agency, or instrumentality of the United States or of any State or local government (other than a dealer, research facility, exhibitor, any person excluded from the definition of a dealer, research facility, or exhibitor, an operator of an auction sale, or a carrier) who is engaged in any business in which he receives custody of animals in connection with their transportation in commerce;
This is such a broad definition and gives us a lot of "wiggle room" with the face-to-face requirement. In essence, as long as the person who takes the dog from your premises to the airport is not you or someone employed by you and is not a professional animal transporter, you should be fine. My husband suggested making a simple form for buyers to sign and send back, which names a local person as their proxy... just to be safe.
Ohhhh here's a good one. A person who goes to dog shows is not an exhibitor; does that mean that showing does doesn't count as exhibition? If so, labeling all puppies as show dogs, and claiming you are breeding for the purpose of showing dogs, would also be a good work around (and truthful at that).
The term "exhibitor" means any person (public or private) exhibiting any animals, which were purchased in commerce or the intended distribution of which affects commerce, or will affect commerce, to the public for compensation, as determined by the Secretary, and such term includes carnivals, circuses, and zoos exhibiting such animals whether operated for profit or not; but such term excludes retail pet stores, organizations sponsoring and all persons participating in State and country fairs, livestock shows, rodeos, purebred dog and cat shows, and any other fairs or exhibitions intended to advance agricultural arts and sciences, as may be determined by the Secretary;
Maybe you could put in your contracts that "this dog is to be used for working and/or breeding unless later found to be unfit for that purpose." If anyone comes knocking at your door, say, "Look, my intent was clearly that they be working/breeding dogs." They have no way to prove otherwise, because they didn't provide any criteria for what a suitable working/breeding dog was. You can just say, he looked at me funn, he's not a good working dog. They can't argue.
According to the document, breeders can have the dogs in their own homes, and are essentially pets, so I don't see anything stopping anyone else from doing that.
The exhibition bit is tricky, because it excludes you from dog shows, but I'm still not clear on whether a dog can be a working dog and a show dog, and is exempt (I don't see anything explicitly stating this).
I would stop doing co-ownerships and if you want to breed the dog, just have it say in the contract that you can breed the dog x number of times if you want.
Have more (non-recordable) phone conversations, as opposed electronic messaging of any kind which can be recorded. Have a friend pick the puppy up and drive it to the airport, just to be on the safe side.
Comments
http://www.ukcdogs.com/Web.nsf/News/USDAFinalRuleChangesandIm09112013030111PM
@sjp051993 - Where did you see that line?
I have not read the official 91 page document yet.
I need to actually sit down and read the whole document before I ask anymore questions. I apologize if my questions are silly.
However, the big document does say that breeding dogs are exempt, along with hunting, security, and "other purpose" working dogs. It clarifies that breeding, hunting, and security dogs are merely examples of purposes for a dog. Guide dogs and other service animals are also exempt; indeed, any purpose which is not one of the main six gets a free pass.
That said, if you sell ANY dog for one of the six purposes which are not exempt (research, teaching, testing, experimentation, exhibition, or pet) you lose the exemption. A dog which is sold for multiple purposes, and one of those purposes is one of those six things, will also cause you to lose the exemption.
In short, if you wish to claim preservation of rare bloodlines, ALL puppies you sell must be sold for breeding and must NOT be pets or show dogs. (Yes, it makes no sense.)
ETA: So basically this sounds to me like if you wanted to preserve a breed, it would be easier to have several people in touch collaborating in breeding efforts (each with less than 4 "breeding females") than having one person trying to make it work with many breeding females..Uy yuy. This is going to get interesting, isn't it...
My primary concern is that we cannot sell retired show/breeding dogs or imports that didn't work out for our breeding program, regardless of the number of females owned.
I also noticed something about some dogs could be sold that are not up to the task.
Sorry if that sounds dumb, but would compensation or donations for other resources for that animal count as selling an animal?
We kinda had an idea this was coming down the pike last year but talk about stinkin it up with convoluted messy info ….. bit of an assumption on cost and effort too. Until there is detailed compliance info it is going to be speculation as far as answers to many of our questions.
Here is a link to the flow chart from the past (change in limit to 4 intact females).
http://www.ofwlaw.com/CM/Custom/APHIS AWA Retail Pet Stores and Licensing Exemption Flowchart (00299615).PDF
In being well informed, what I am trying to figure out where the "risk base inspection system" they speak of is outlined that calculates the risk levels for a kennel? In addition, where is the "facility compliance standard" documentation listed for AWA? I am not familiar with the APHIS process so maybe I missed it, but I don't see regulation standards for "wholesalers" or reference to where those regs can be found for those that have more than four breeding bitches. If someone has a link to any of the aforementioned please post it.
Snf
@*JackBurton* Right. Any animal which was not born and raised on your premises must be sold face-to-face to remain exempt. The four female rule does not apply. Here is the entire section explained: EDIT: I am going to make a "Do I need a license?" flow chart later
Snf
I've been moving away from pet show for a couple litters now. I get plenty of pet apps so I'm just going to have people come get them and the long coats. The shows which "meet the standard" are the only shipped pups. I'll still keep with my policy of paying for the owners Akiho and JACA membership as this promotes the preservation angle. Besides ill only have two intact females.
One thing that I won't get involved in is importing pups for others.
It's all very similar to the sale of firearms. There really isn't any enforceable regulation outside of vendor and mail order sales. For a similar situation, I could sell all the moonshine I want face to face, it's when it goes through the mail or taxable channels that it becomes an issue.
Also, keep in mind that emails count as legal communication documents that can be utilized in court for any reason. Just a helpful tidbit.
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/USCODE-2009-title7/html/USCODE-2009-title7-chap54.htm This is such a broad definition and gives us a lot of "wiggle room" with the face-to-face requirement. In essence, as long as the person who takes the dog from your premises to the airport is not you or someone employed by you and is not a professional animal transporter, you should be fine. My husband suggested making a simple form for buyers to sign and send back, which names a local person as their proxy... just to be safe.
http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/FR-2012-05-16/html/2012-11839.htm
Of course if they don't show they don't get a new letter from the clubs.
I wish the AKC and/or UKC would offer seminars on how to understand these rules/definitions and how to be a legal breeder.
According to the document, breeders can have the dogs in their own homes, and are essentially pets, so I don't see anything stopping anyone else from doing that.
The exhibition bit is tricky, because it excludes you from dog shows, but I'm still not clear on whether a dog can be a working dog and a show dog, and is exempt (I don't see anything explicitly stating this).
I would stop doing co-ownerships and if you want to breed the dog, just have it say in the contract that you can breed the dog x number of times if you want.
Have more (non-recordable) phone conversations, as opposed electronic messaging of any kind which can be recorded. Have a friend pick the puppy up and drive it to the airport, just to be on the safe side.