Help me out with housetraining

Heidi

Obviously I'm doing something wrong here, because Sosuke was doing really well the first little while, but today and yesterday, it's like he's just decided to pee indoors willy nilly. About an hour ago, I took him out to pee. He peed, and I brought him back in for living room play time, and twenty minutes later he peed on the floor! I took him out again, and he didn't pee, so I figured he was done, but five minutes later, he peed on the floor AGAIN! Noah also said he peed on the floor this morning before I got up. What the heck?!

We had a good schedule going where he'd go out every hour, and if he peed, he got to spend the next hour playing in the living room. If not, he'd go in his crate with some chews and was let out again periodically until he peed, and every time following a pee, he'd get an hour running loose. He also spends some time in the backyard, if I think he's spending too much time in his crate. I've catch him every time he's had an accident, and I immediately take him outside.

He's good at letting us know when he has to poop, so that's nice. He was also giving pretty good cues about when he would pee. He'd whine a little and seem restless, but today and yesterday, he just pees on the floor with no warning.

jujee

Ha, we are both having problems it seems. Kyuubi also was very good the first few days. Sunday morning he went in his crate at 3am (after being let out at 12am). He cried after he went potty in his crate. Usually he would cry before hand, but I guess not? He also has been going in the house too without giving a warning at all and even after being let out to go.

I figure we just need to be more diligent about watching him and crating him. He does drink a lot of water! Right when he's let out of his crate he goes for water. So I guess we just need to take him out more often. Looks like you are crating him often to make sure there are no accidents.

This is almost total opposite from Mika lol cause she was so easy to house break. Maybe boys are harder to house break?

Edgewood

I feel for you....not really sure what to suggest. Maybe Brad will chime in.

But, FWIW, I swore that females are HARDER to housebreak, at least my female shikoku was. The male was a breeze :-)

Losech

Conker was a pain in the butt to housebreak. You'd think that him being a Shiba would have made that easy. Nope.
He only peed in his crate once though, that was nice. However, he would show no signs of needing to pee AT ALL and would just let loose in the house. It was highly obnoxious but we ended up taking him out every 20 minutes until he peed (living in an apartment at the time, that was a PITA) then he came back in. Out after every play session, out after drinking, sleeping, eating... Anything he did that wasn't walking around he went out. And got much praise for peeing outside. We were eventually able to graduate to every 30 minutes, then every hour, then every two hours and so on. But it took a while until he was trustworthy in the apartment. Had to do it allover again when I moved back to Oregon.

tjbart17

@hondru Is Sosuke drinking too much water?

@jujee Drinking a lot of water can be a sign of anxiety and habit forming. You should pull the water, and only let him drink when he's eating and throughout the day when he needs to. Sounds like he's drinking too much water to effectively potty train.

dlroberts

Have you been praising him lavishly for peeing outside? It sounds like you're trying to reward him for peeing with playtime, but I wonder if he's not making the association yet. I would really go over the top with "good boy"s and pets the instant he's peeing outside, and not be afraid to give a stern "NO" when he is caught peeing inside and actually carry him out.

You'll get there. Potty training, like with everything in dog training, will be somewhat fluid (pun intended). They'll have good days and bad days. In a few weeks you'll be looking back on this with a dog that reliably goes 2 hours and feel like it's in the distant past. :-)

Heidi

@Losech - I guess that's the strategy. Just be painfully diligent. BTW, I know what you mean about the apartment-living. When we got our shiba Tojo, we lived in an apartment and yeah, that was a PITA.

@tjbart17 - I don't think so. He drinks after eating and after he's been really active. Seems normal compared to the other dogs I've owned.

@dlroberts - Oh yeah, I act like he's picked the winning lottery ticket and I give him treats. And, you're right about looking back in a few weeks. Thanks for reminding me.

So, the rest of today's been pretty good. I think things will be alright. ) I was just pretty worried after this morning.

shibamistress

I think its just that it feels endless. They get it.....but it takes awhile. I know I was going crazy with oskar--I kept thinking he was trained, because he'd go a week, then he peed in the house again. He was 4 months old when I started to think he was never going to get it.

And then he did. hang in there--this is the less fun part of puppyhood!

tjbart17

. Don't be jealous but Koda never peed in the house. At five months old he was in MENSA. Lol

TaraA

Hi,

There's not much more advice I can add. The only thing that I noticed while potty training Panda was that when we played hard or she got over-excited she almost always peed. Maybe try keeping them more calm in the house, so less exciting play activities until they get the idea that outside is the potty area. I also took the water away at 7pm each night. Just an idea

tjbart17

@TaraA I'm just going to throw this out there, but that sounds more of a Shikoku thing to do. I may be totally wrong, but I can't picture Kais nervous/excitement peeing.

BradA1878

I have no advice to give. We are failing miserably with potty training Taka at the moment. For me to give advice would be a bit ironic. lol

I've noticed this tho, most new pups do really well for the first 2 weeks here and then start to slip - I think it's a comfort level thing. At first they are not as comfortable so they hold it, but as the get more comfortable in the new environment (and caught up in all the other things to do) they start to slip. Akashi and Ame did this, Parka did it, and now Taka is doing it too. It's like a reset.

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jujee

I just had an epic fail with Kyuubi! He had been out back playing with Mika and went potty a few times. He laid down when he was tired so I moved him to the grass and asked him to go which he did. Lots of praise and inside we went so he could nap. He was sleeping so I decided to go finish my laundry and when I come back he's laying in a puddle of urine

I take him outside to see if he needs to go again. Out there for a good 15 mins and he doesn't go. So I take him back in and put him down so I can clean his crate. As I'm cleaning I hear him tinkling on the rug

cmpteki

Any chance he is peeing in or around the same place? Just wondering if he is smelling something from the first accident that might be triggering that it is an ok place to go.

WildSolo

When we got Kuki, he had a couple of accidents in the first two days he was with us.
No problem, to be expected, right?. So we go two weeks with no incidents.

One day after being outside for a while, comes in the house and pees in the living room.
He did the same thing a couple of days later. No warning, right in front of us.

We then banned him from the living room, because that was the only place in the house he pee'd.
Next, we increased our vigilance for his cues on going outside. We also made sure to give him lots of praise whenever we took him out to pee. Maybe we had started to slack in that area.

Heidi

There was a spot he was going to regularly, but it's easy to catch him doing that. If he goes over there, I whisk him outside. I don't think there's any smell remaining, because the spot he chose was laminate and I always scrub it good and use odour-eliminator. I can't see much odour being left over after that. I think it's a spatial thing, because it's just the furthest place in that room from where we play and hang out. There were a couple times where he just starting peeing in the middle of the floor out of the blue, and I'm wondering if that is just a simple bladder control issue. If he's excited and interested in something else, he might be distracted from the fact that he has to go until the last second. I suppose that just improves with age.

I have noticed that we have more problems in the morning and evening. He seems to need to pee really frequently at those times, and like I said in my original post, that series of incidents was in the morning. I guess that makes sense, since that's when dogs are more active (being crepuscular and all).

We've made quite good progress even since I posted this, though. Sosuke usually goes over to the baby gate that keeps him in the living room (that's the puppy-safe room he's allowed to be in) and scratches at it or just whines and looks at me. So, that's very good. He also has never peed in his crate.

@jujee - Peeing during a nap definitely seems like a simple bladder control issue to me. Was he in his crate? Maybe our pups just need to get a little older.

Sangmort

Hey Heidi, have you tried using a crate? I had a lot of trouble potty-training both boys without using the crate. I read somewhere that the crate really teaches them to hold it, that just because they "can go" doesn't mean they "should."

Good luck! Puppies come with fun stuff & not so fun stuff, huh? lol ~

WrylyBrindle

Jeff had 2 requests for training the third dog- #1 that I should train her to pee on command so she will go if we need her to be quick about it and #2 that for once could we have a dog that doenst beg at the table?

to stay in his good graces, I have been marking (pun not intended but we;ll go with it) all Juno's tinkles with "hurry,hurry" and big praises. I take up water after 7:30 pm, and she sleeps in the smaller crate. She will pee in the big wire crate if I park her in there for a bit. She has not had any accidents in the plastic crate (overnight or the plastic crate in the car at work) I think the wire crate is just too big.

I visited friends with a 13 week old Berner last night, and they are getting up at night several times to let her out still, so I feel kind of lucky.

hesitate to say it, but (knock on wood) she has not peed on the rug/floor in a while now, but she does go outside a lot.

jujee

When Kyuubi peed on the rug yesterday it was his first time so no lingering scent there. He will potty in his crate. It seems he only cries when being in the crate when I leave. He never cries in it to let me know he needs to go potty. He cries after he pottys and is covered in his own pee lol. I guess I may have to wake up every 3 hours at night because he had an accident around 4-5am ish.

I took him out 4x from 10pm - 1am to go potty. So at 1am (after I got finish studying for midterms I'm taking this evening) I figured he went 4x in the past 3 hours without anymore intake of water that he should be able to make it to 6am. Nope, I woke up to his little whines around 5am because he was now covered in pee. He hasn't had a poo accident though, so that's good.

I want to try to get him to go potty on command, I tried with Mika, but she is very picky about where she pees so sometimes she holds it even after two 40 minute walks if we didn't go by a spot that she approves of. Mika was very good about not having accidents, I think maybe one that I could remember her having.

Heidi

Whenever Sosuke has an accident, it's when I'm not paying close enough attention. So, I really need to be strict with myself about having either in his crate or in the yard if I'm not paying really close attention to him. Noah's getting frustrated with this, but I think he's comparing Sosuke to Tojo who was so meticulous that the few times he did have accidents, he covered them with tissues. I'm trying to convince him that it's normal to have accidents at this age, but it would probably just be better if I'm just so diligent that there aren't any more accidents.

Heidi

I found this schedule for housetraining: http://www.leecharleskelley.com/images/Housebreaking.pdf

Seems like an awful lot of crate time. What do you guys think? I also don't know why the schedule for 3-6 month old puppies whose owners work all day has the puppy in the crate from 8am-6pm, but the 6-12 month old puppies whose owners work all day are getting let out several times between 8am and 6pm.

lindsayt

Wow, it seems Kai in general have a longer potty training time. I wonder how the Shiba ended up being so OCD about pee and poo?

BradA1878

Not all Kai, just this litter. I was telling Julie that most Kai are super easy to potty train but this litter has really sucked. Tyson and Akashi were also hard to potty train in the beginning too. Ayu, Mochi, Tora, Kumi, and Kona wee perfect tho. Strange.

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jujee

Haha. So yesterday I came home from showing a contractor the place we are moving into so we can fix up a few things before moving in. I was gone for 20 minutes. I came home and went upstairs to get Kyuubi to let him out. He was laying in the same sleeping position as when I left. His back to the back side of the crate. I opened the door and he's laying there in his sleeping position peeing. Haha.

so I found out why I never heard him pee the nights that he had accidents. he would be laying down n just pee instead.

However, if there is a towel in the crate he will move it around with his muzzle and clean up his mess so he can go back to sleep.

Silly pup!

MirkaM

Nuuk still have accidents but not very often tho. Accidents happen when he have to be alone 8 hours so I'm not blaming him. But still it better than my mum Schipps. Only the male is completely potty trained but the others... Well, they really aren't (Nuuk did better when than them when he came to me!).

@jujee I just loved the towel story, you have to admit that he is trying .

WrylyBrindle

Not to be That Girl, but (knock on wood) Juno has been really reasonable. She has only had mistakes in the living room wire crate, never the plastic crate, never in the wire car crate, not in the rooms of the house. She pees on cue, and takes advantage of her Outside times, always first thing. Just saying theres hope...

BradA1878

Well, at least one of us is succeeding! lol

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WCP

So glad I didn't get one of those pups haha

well not really, but kinda

Heidi

Sosuke's been quite good lately. He has never peed in his crate, ever. He's in the adult-sized wire crate without a divider and he never pees in it. He pees on command, unless he's distracted or excited, but then it's just a matter of either waiting for him to calm down, or just putting him back in his crate and trying again in 15 minutes or so.

Although, he does seem to think that it's okay to poop in the kids' room. He's done it 3 or 4 times, so he's not allowed down there unless he's been out recently and someone's with him.

He's doing pretty well, though. Can't complain too much. I kind of feel like this is my first time actually housetraining a dog because Tojo was born housetrained and any other dog I've owned I got as an adult.

WrylyBrindle

Of course this came back to bite me in the butt!... usually I carry her down stairs to get out to the dog yard for First Outs. This morning I got cocky & let her walk herself but all that legwork was too much and she dumped it all out at the top of the stairs. At least it was on the WAY to the right answer...and on the linoleum.

kaikenone

I would rule out any health problems first.

While I do feel NK breeds are generally a lot easier to housebreak than other breeds, I think we have all had this problem.

It is too funny when I start taking babys outside. It only takes 1 or 2 times for them to figure it out. The boys are especially funny, they will start screaming to go out and stand on the side of the crate trying to climb out and since they are too young to hold it, they actually start peeing out the side of the the crate. At first I could not figure out why the floor was always wet, and then I caught them.. it was so funny.

I find that Kai puppys who are raised in the house without a dog door may actually be harder to house break unless you are able to get them outside immediately everytime they have to pee, which means standing a crate side constantly. Everytime they pee in the crate you are actually teaching them by repetition to go there...

One thing I think that most of us do not think about is, that when we put the puppy out and he goes and we let him play for a while and then we bring him back in. Well he may have to go again because he has been playing for an hour. But he does not think like we do "hey we are going back in the house so I better pee again, cause I wil be in there for awhile" so he comes in and immediately pees. It is better to crate him for 5 minutes and then immediately take him back out to pee and bring him back in to be loose.

A lot of owners let their dog out all day to play and then bring him in for the night and the dogs has to pee again.Then they think why didn't you pee outside, you were out there all day, again the dog/puppy doesn't reason he is going to be in all night, go to the bathroom before you go in.. 5 to 10 minutes after bringing him in he should go back out long enough to pee.

Another thing I have found in my own personal experiences is that if the puppy starts peeing in his crate and you immediately get him out because he is screaming, he will actually learn to pee first and then scream because you will get him out.. I would leave him there for awhile, I know this is gross but it prevents a bad habit from forming..just wait until the screaming stops. I had a Shiba who did this, he did not let you know he had to go out, he would imediatley wake up pee and then start screaming so I would immediately get him out before he was soaked. No matter what I tried he would not stop. I was so frustrated one day I left him for awhile. ( I know I was bad) I told him he could just sit in it, I didn't care. From that time on he never did it again.

Now I am not saying don't get him out and clean his cage. I am saying don't do it immediately after he pees and starts screaming he will associate this as a way to get out and may use it to his advantage.

I do crate all young puppys/dogs or new dogs (any age) to come to stay/live with me. I carry young puppys to the door so they have to go straight out and either carry or put a leash on older ones at first so they have no chance to stop along the way.

As a rule of thumb I tell all new puppy owners puppys need to go out immediately after they sleep, after they eat, after they drink and after they play. And you wouldn't leave your baby loose in the other room while you take a shower etc. don't leave your puppy alone. If you can't stand their with them crate them.Placing a lease on them when they are uncrated and tying it to your self is a good way to keep tabs and also teaches them to be your shadow.

sorry I got a little, well ok then, a lot long winded...
jeez that was more of a speech than an opinion..