You probably can't discuss it here, but why are there restrictions? Is it believed to be beneficial to breed preservation to have those types of restrictions by the KKA?
@tsukitsune - Well, I guess it comes down to the reason why the KKA was started.
The KKA was created due to disagreement with the NIPPO standard for the Kai Ken - specifically the size of the breed. NIPPO wanted to group the Kai Ken into the medium-sized group but the original Kai Ken stewards felt that the Kai Ken really fell somewhere between the small and medium sized groups (smaller than medium but larger than small). Due to that disagreement (as well as other differences in the standards), the KKA was created to preserve the Kai Ken's original "type".
I think the KKA enforces these restrictions in order to prevent their KKA Kai Ken from being altered to reflect the NIPPO Kai Ken standard. Keep in mind the KKA registry represents the majority of the Kai Ken in the world. So these restrictions help to keep the majority of the Kai Ken in-line with the KKA standard (which is the more open Kai Ken standard).
@jan3t - Kumi is a very loving and friendly little lady. She is tough as nails too and built like a little tank. She can be pretty gritty at times but she is an easy dog to live with. She's not a quarrelsome dog at all but she can be a bit of an antagonist at times.
@tjbart17 - Well, the definition is "Showing courage and resolve"... When I use the term I tend to be referring to a dog who is "spunky" and "feisty" and has a lot of "fight" in them. And by "fight" I don't mean they like to fight, I mean that they tend to choose "fight" over "flight" - which I guess really just comes down to them having "courage".
After reading this whole discussion, I re-read TheWalrus' post on the kai ken with the discussion of the KKA and NIPPO. If the UKC accepts the KKA standard, would the KKA accept the duel registration? Does someone from the KKA come to the USA to judge breed shows? How is the breed judged in Japan? Personally, the slightly more than small (and slightly less than medium) size is very nice in a dog that I want to take everywhere with me.
I also really appreciate the discussions of the personality in planning a breeding. Too many breeds have been diluted by a lack of such attention. I was at a dog show in the 1980 standing in line behind a man who was bragging that he handled the dog that ruined the American cocker. Apparently the dog was such a big winner everyone bred to him despite his terrible personality. I have no idea if this man's story is true or even if cockers were ruined, but I am glad that you're paying attention! I love the 'gritty' look to the kai ken! That only comes from personality.
If the UKC accepts the KKA standard, would the KKA accept the duel registration? >> No, KKA would still not allow dual registration. The value the KKA --> UKC thing adds is the ability for imports to be switched to UKC reg and used in the North American gene pool. Also, this allows owners of pups from KKA registered kennels to switch registration to UKC and participate in UKC events.
Does someone from the KKA come to the USA to judge breed shows? >> That's never happened in the past, but there are efforts being made to have a KKA-sanctioned club that would hold a annual or biannual Kai Ken Tenrankai where a KKA judge would be invited to judge the dogs.
How is the breed judged in Japan? >> The Kai Ken Aigokai holds a biannual Tenrankai where judges judge the dogs to the KKA standard. Shigs has posted some videos from these events in the past: http://www.nihonken.org/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/2363
Too many breeds have been diluted by a lack of such attention. >> I agree, but I think in many cases it took just as much attention to dilute a breed as it does to preserve a breed, it's a matter of the focus of the attention (ie focusing too much on looks and type vs health and temperament).
Brad wrote, "I agree, but I think in many cases it took just as much attention to dilute a breed as it does to preserve a breed, it's a matter of the focus of the attention (ie focusing too much on looks and type vs health and temperament)."
Absolutely, and that's why the discussion on breeding that included temperament warms my heart!
@kaikenone - Sorry for the delay, I just bought a house and have been traveling, so I haven't been on the forum in a few weeks. Here are some picasa web albums with pictures of Tyson. They are organized in chronological order. My new backyard is massive compared to my old one and has much better light, so I expect posting pictures of him will be a more regular activity once I get settled in and unpacked. :-)
@dlroberts-congratulations on the new house,hope the move is going well. where are you located now? Great pictures of Tyson.He looks really good.cant wait to see more.
@kaikenone - Thanks! I'm still in NC, I just moved from a rental house to my dream house in the woods. I have an acre of property that borders a 40,000 acre state/county park/game lands. It's kinda surreal. :-)
@kaikenone@sunyata - I'd be happy to! We've got plenty of space, both in the house with beds and tent space on the property, hiking trails, and a lake for lounging. Just give me time to get fully moved in! :-)
Comments
The KKA was created due to disagreement with the NIPPO standard for the Kai Ken - specifically the size of the breed. NIPPO wanted to group the Kai Ken into the medium-sized group but the original Kai Ken stewards felt that the Kai Ken really fell somewhere between the small and medium sized groups (smaller than medium but larger than small). Due to that disagreement (as well as other differences in the standards), the KKA was created to preserve the Kai Ken's original "type".
I think the KKA enforces these restrictions in order to prevent their KKA Kai Ken from being altered to reflect the NIPPO Kai Ken standard. Keep in mind the KKA registry represents the majority of the Kai Ken in the world. So these restrictions help to keep the majority of the Kai Ken in-line with the KKA standard (which is the more open Kai Ken standard).
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Does a puppy that is nicely brindled start showing the markings early or is there just no way to predict the coat?
As for your question about the brindle markings, you can see it at birth tho it will change with time. Take a look at this thread as it shows Kai pups at birth to 8 weeks: http://www.nihonken.org/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/comment/120262/#Comment_120262
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After reading this whole discussion, I re-read TheWalrus' post on the kai ken with the discussion of the KKA and NIPPO. If the UKC accepts the KKA standard, would the KKA accept the duel registration? Does someone from the KKA come to the USA to judge breed shows? How is the breed judged in Japan? Personally, the slightly more than small (and slightly less than medium) size is very nice in a dog that I want to take everywhere with me.
I also really appreciate the discussions of the personality in planning a breeding. Too many breeds have been diluted by a lack of such attention. I was at a dog show in the 1980 standing in line behind a man who was bragging that he handled the dog that ruined the American cocker. Apparently the dog was such a big winner everyone bred to him despite his terrible personality. I have no idea if this man's story is true or even if cockers were ruined, but I am glad that you're paying attention! I love the 'gritty' look to the kai ken! That only comes from personality.
If the UKC accepts the KKA standard, would the KKA accept the duel registration?
>> No, KKA would still not allow dual registration. The value the KKA --> UKC thing adds is the ability for imports to be switched to UKC reg and used in the North American gene pool. Also, this allows owners of pups from KKA registered kennels to switch registration to UKC and participate in UKC events.
Does someone from the KKA come to the USA to judge breed shows?
>> That's never happened in the past, but there are efforts being made to have a KKA-sanctioned club that would hold a annual or biannual Kai Ken Tenrankai where a KKA judge would be invited to judge the dogs.
How is the breed judged in Japan?
>> The Kai Ken Aigokai holds a biannual Tenrankai where judges judge the dogs to the KKA standard. Shigs has posted some videos from these events in the past: http://www.nihonken.org/forum/index.php?p=/discussion/2363
Too many breeds have been diluted by a lack of such attention.
>> I agree, but I think in many cases it took just as much attention to dilute a breed as it does to preserve a breed, it's a matter of the focus of the attention (ie focusing too much on looks and type vs health and temperament).
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Absolutely, and that's why the discussion on breeding that included temperament warms my heart!
https://picasaweb.google.com/dlroberts/TysonHuntingRandom?authkey=Gv1sRgCM340IKSnemkIg#
https://picasaweb.google.com/dlroberts/TysonLakeRaleigh122010#
https://picasaweb.google.com/dlroberts/TysonAndersonCreek92510FirstBirdExperience?authkey=Gv1sRgCN6OupmPrfqWoAE#
https://picasaweb.google.com/dlroberts/AndersonCreek8810#
https://picasaweb.google.com/dlroberts/TysonSFirstVisitToAWMA#
So as not to totally derail from the topic of this thread: Brad, Kumi seems like an awesome gal. How old is she now?
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can I second that????